Divided Families of Marblehead and Halifax with G. Patrick O'Brien

"Place is of very little consequence," Mary Sewall of Marblehead wrote to her sister in Nova Scotia in 1799," except as it brings you near to those whom by nature you are most nearly allied."  The Sewall sisters had been separated by war, yet family ties endured and complicated their relationships in the post-Revolutionary world.   Patrick O'Brien of the University of Tampa, writing about the divided families of Marblehead, joins us to talk about the ties sundered by the Revolution and those that remained.

Transcript

WEBVTT
 
 00:00:00.612 --> 00:00:01.334
 Hello, everyone.
 
 00:00:01.374 --> 00:00:02.416
 Welcome to the Revolution
 
 00:00:02.436 --> 00:00:03.640
 Two-Fifty podcast.
 
 00:00:03.721 --> 00:00:04.562
 I am Bob Allison.
 
 00:00:04.623 --> 00:00:06.628
 I chair the Rev Two-Fifty advisory group.
 
 00:00:07.096 --> 00:00:08.496
 We are a consortium of about
 
 00:00:08.557 --> 00:00:09.936
 seventy-five organizations
 
 00:00:09.977 --> 00:00:11.178
 in Massachusetts planning
 
 00:00:11.518 --> 00:00:13.538
 commemorations of American independence.
 
 00:00:13.618 --> 00:00:16.521
 And our guest today is G. Patrick O'Brien.
 
 00:00:17.580 --> 00:00:18.481
 Patrick O'Brien is an
 
 00:00:18.521 --> 00:00:19.282
 assistant teaching
 
 00:00:19.301 --> 00:00:21.664
 professor at the University of Tampa,
 
 00:00:22.123 --> 00:00:23.143
 published extensively,
 
 00:00:23.164 --> 00:00:24.265
 has a great article in the
 
 00:00:24.304 --> 00:00:26.405
 New England Quarterly about Flora Lee,
 
 00:00:26.466 --> 00:00:29.126
 and his real project is a
 
 00:00:29.167 --> 00:00:31.027
 book unknown and unlamented,
 
 00:00:31.088 --> 00:00:32.689
 The Exile and Repatriation
 
 00:00:32.709 --> 00:00:33.850
 of a Loyalist Family,
 
 00:00:34.329 --> 00:00:36.310
 in the era of the American Revolution.
 
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 And we'll be talking a lot
 
 00:00:37.512 --> 00:00:39.112
 about that today, that family today.
 
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 Pat, thanks for joining us.
 
 00:00:40.793 --> 00:00:41.994
 Thanks for having me, Bob.
 
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 I'm a frequent listener,
 
 00:00:43.235 --> 00:00:45.517
 so it's a real honor to be on today.
 
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 Great.
 
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 Thank you.
 
 00:00:47.738 --> 00:00:49.780
 And so you've written about
 
 00:00:51.100 --> 00:00:52.240
 the Mary Sewell Robey,
 
 00:00:52.261 --> 00:00:54.283
 the Robey family from Marblehead.
 
 00:00:54.402 --> 00:00:55.944
 And why don't we just talk about them?
 
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 What leads them to exile?
 
 00:00:57.825 --> 00:00:58.865
 What happens to them?
 
 00:00:59.026 --> 00:01:00.426
 And what else do you have to
 
 00:01:00.466 --> 00:01:01.027
 say about them?
 
 00:01:01.587 --> 00:01:02.828
 So it was actually really
 
 00:01:02.968 --> 00:01:04.829
 interesting coming to this family,
 
 00:01:04.870 --> 00:01:06.492
 the Roby family from Marblehead.
 
 00:01:07.031 --> 00:01:08.433
 I first entered the archive
 
 00:01:08.472 --> 00:01:09.915
 as a graduate student at
 
 00:01:09.935 --> 00:01:10.896
 the Massachusetts
 
 00:01:10.975 --> 00:01:12.576
 Historical Society Archives
 
 00:01:12.736 --> 00:01:14.478
 in Boston on Boylston Street.
 
 00:01:15.159 --> 00:01:16.320
 And I came into the archive
 
 00:01:16.340 --> 00:01:17.001
 with like some different
 
 00:01:17.021 --> 00:01:19.082
 questions about colonialism.
 
 00:01:19.183 --> 00:01:20.084
 I was really interested in
 
 00:01:20.123 --> 00:01:21.444
 juxtaposing what happens in
 
 00:01:21.484 --> 00:01:23.807
 New England with Acadia, Acadie,
 
 00:01:24.487 --> 00:01:25.448
 and kind of thinking about
 
 00:01:25.808 --> 00:01:27.150
 the greater American Northeast.
 
 00:01:27.850 --> 00:01:29.091
 And when I got into the archives,
 
 00:01:29.111 --> 00:01:29.832
 I was pulling pretty much
 
 00:01:29.933 --> 00:01:31.134
 anything that could connect
 
 00:01:31.153 --> 00:01:32.715
 Massachusetts and Nova Scotia.
 
 00:01:33.355 --> 00:01:35.757
 And one of the boxes,
 
 00:01:35.817 --> 00:01:37.700
 one of the collections, three boxes total,
 
 00:01:38.400 --> 00:01:40.602
 pertain to a Roby Sewell family.
 
 00:01:40.942 --> 00:01:42.924
 And I was familiar with that name, Roby.
 
 00:01:43.465 --> 00:01:45.527
 My family are Nova Scotians,
 
 00:01:46.106 --> 00:01:46.987
 live in Halifax.
 
 00:01:47.128 --> 00:01:48.709
 And so Roby Street is a main
 
 00:01:48.769 --> 00:01:51.251
 thoroughfare in the city of Halifax.
 
 00:01:51.871 --> 00:01:53.352
 And so I was familiar with
 
 00:01:53.373 --> 00:01:54.173
 that name and I said, OK,
 
 00:01:54.192 --> 00:01:55.453
 we should look and see what's in here,
 
 00:01:55.493 --> 00:01:56.314
 because there might be some
 
 00:01:56.355 --> 00:01:56.935
 good stuff about
 
 00:01:56.974 --> 00:01:57.915
 connections between Nova
 
 00:01:57.954 --> 00:01:59.977
 Scotia and New England.
 
 00:02:00.656 --> 00:02:03.018
 And the documents I found,
 
 00:02:03.298 --> 00:02:05.278
 especially a diary kept by
 
 00:02:05.319 --> 00:02:06.219
 the then eighteen,
 
 00:02:06.260 --> 00:02:08.100
 nineteen year old Mary Roby,
 
 00:02:08.920 --> 00:02:10.622
 describing her life as a
 
 00:02:10.701 --> 00:02:13.044
 loyalist exile in Halifax.
 
 00:02:13.883 --> 00:02:15.066
 led me to find that I'd
 
 00:02:15.105 --> 00:02:15.866
 found everything I needed
 
 00:02:15.887 --> 00:02:17.109
 for my doctoral dissertation.
 
 00:02:17.429 --> 00:02:18.509
 I was no longer going to be
 
 00:02:18.550 --> 00:02:19.752
 writing about colonization
 
 00:02:19.771 --> 00:02:20.332
 in the Northeast.
 
 00:02:20.353 --> 00:02:20.973
 I was going to be writing
 
 00:02:20.993 --> 00:02:21.735
 about the Loyalists,
 
 00:02:22.215 --> 00:02:24.177
 which I was really excited to be doing,
 
 00:02:24.497 --> 00:02:25.239
 but looking at it from a
 
 00:02:25.278 --> 00:02:26.259
 slightly different lens.
 
 00:02:26.841 --> 00:02:29.063
 So the Roby family are very interesting.
 
 00:02:29.183 --> 00:02:30.526
 The patriarch of the family
 
 00:02:30.605 --> 00:02:31.687
 is Thomas Roby,
 
 00:02:32.788 --> 00:02:34.890
 His father of the same name, Thomas Roby,
 
 00:02:35.271 --> 00:02:36.492
 had been a Harvard tutor,
 
 00:02:37.074 --> 00:02:37.854
 Harvard educated,
 
 00:02:37.895 --> 00:02:39.417
 was actually a renowned scientist,
 
 00:02:39.477 --> 00:02:41.399
 had published widely on
 
 00:02:41.819 --> 00:02:43.301
 spider venom and the
 
 00:02:43.342 --> 00:02:44.864
 eclipses and was known in
 
 00:02:45.424 --> 00:02:47.447
 England as well as Europe more broadly.
 
 00:02:48.046 --> 00:02:49.209
 He actually dies the same
 
 00:02:49.248 --> 00:02:51.472
 year that his son, Thomas Roby, is born.
 
 00:02:51.951 --> 00:02:54.133
 So Thomas Roby's left fatherless.
 
 00:02:54.554 --> 00:02:54.954
 Luckily,
 
 00:02:54.993 --> 00:02:57.134
 his mother is a Sewell with
 
 00:02:57.175 --> 00:02:58.736
 connections to the, of course,
 
 00:02:58.776 --> 00:03:00.116
 important Sewell family.
 
 00:03:00.518 --> 00:03:02.818
 So he's raised in Boston and
 
 00:03:02.859 --> 00:03:05.181
 Salem alongside a very
 
 00:03:05.200 --> 00:03:07.722
 important cousin of his, Jonathan Sewell,
 
 00:03:08.203 --> 00:03:09.903
 who is also left fatherless.
 
 00:03:09.924 --> 00:03:11.085
 So the two of them actually
 
 00:03:11.104 --> 00:03:12.485
 have kind of a similar connection.
 
 00:03:13.366 --> 00:03:14.326
 And this is really important
 
 00:03:14.347 --> 00:03:15.567
 in shaping Thomas Roby's life.
 
 00:03:15.646 --> 00:03:16.927
 He does not go to Harvard
 
 00:03:16.967 --> 00:03:18.408
 like his cousin does,
 
 00:03:18.429 --> 00:03:19.748
 who becomes the attorney general,
 
 00:03:19.788 --> 00:03:20.810
 last colonial attorney
 
 00:03:20.830 --> 00:03:21.830
 general of Massachusetts.
 
 00:03:22.229 --> 00:03:24.050
 Instead, he enters the hardware business.
 
 00:03:24.532 --> 00:03:26.271
 He apprentices in Boston and
 
 00:03:26.292 --> 00:03:27.793
 then moves to Marblehead in
 
 00:03:27.832 --> 00:03:28.954
 the seventeen fifties.
 
 00:03:29.554 --> 00:03:31.055
 And Marblehead is a town on the up and up,
 
 00:03:31.115 --> 00:03:31.335
 right?
 
 00:03:31.414 --> 00:03:32.134
 On the rise.
 
 00:03:32.695 --> 00:03:34.576
 The fishing moguls of
 
 00:03:34.676 --> 00:03:35.896
 Marblehead create a real
 
 00:03:35.937 --> 00:03:38.359
 demand for fine goods,
 
 00:03:38.399 --> 00:03:39.498
 especially hardware goods
 
 00:03:39.618 --> 00:03:41.319
 imported from Britain.
 
 00:03:41.661 --> 00:03:42.860
 And this is what Thomas Roby
 
 00:03:42.920 --> 00:03:43.701
 specializes in.
 
 00:03:44.542 --> 00:03:45.522
 So in the seventeen fifties,
 
 00:03:45.562 --> 00:03:46.582
 sixties and seventies,
 
 00:03:46.663 --> 00:03:47.563
 he becomes one of the
 
 00:03:47.623 --> 00:03:49.884
 biggest importers of British goods.
 
 00:03:50.645 --> 00:03:52.287
 And he importantly marries
 
 00:03:52.387 --> 00:03:54.228
 into a very important family,
 
 00:03:54.548 --> 00:03:55.949
 the Bradstreet family.
 
 00:03:56.068 --> 00:03:58.569
 Simon Bradstreet was a
 
 00:03:58.650 --> 00:03:59.871
 minister at the Second
 
 00:03:59.911 --> 00:04:01.491
 Congregational Church in Marblehead.
 
 00:04:02.051 --> 00:04:04.253
 He marries his daughter, Mary Bradstreet.
 
 00:04:04.614 --> 00:04:05.554
 And so this connection to
 
 00:04:05.614 --> 00:04:06.615
 one of these Bradstreet's
 
 00:04:06.655 --> 00:04:08.075
 connected with Anne Bradstreet.
 
 00:04:08.786 --> 00:04:09.347
 Yes, they are.
 
 00:04:09.387 --> 00:04:11.331
 Direct descendants of Simon Bradstreet,
 
 00:04:11.352 --> 00:04:13.836
 the governor, and then of Anne Bradstreet,
 
 00:04:13.877 --> 00:04:14.318
 his wife.
 
 00:04:14.799 --> 00:04:15.981
 So he marries into this very
 
 00:04:16.002 --> 00:04:16.923
 important family, which...
 
 00:04:18.038 --> 00:04:19.059
 Works out quite well for him
 
 00:04:19.238 --> 00:04:20.740
 after Simon Bradstreet's passing.
 
 00:04:21.100 --> 00:04:23.262
 They buy a really big brick home,
 
 00:04:23.502 --> 00:04:24.862
 which is now ironically on
 
 00:04:24.942 --> 00:04:25.783
 Washington Street.
 
 00:04:25.923 --> 00:04:27.103
 I like that great irony to
 
 00:04:27.144 --> 00:04:28.404
 history as a loyalist
 
 00:04:28.425 --> 00:04:30.125
 family on what's now Washington Street.
 
 00:04:30.586 --> 00:04:31.607
 But that was the main street
 
 00:04:31.646 --> 00:04:32.827
 there in Marblehead.
 
 00:04:33.468 --> 00:04:34.548
 And he gets into a bit of
 
 00:04:34.588 --> 00:04:35.949
 trouble in the
 
 00:04:35.990 --> 00:04:37.031
 late-seventeen-sixties and
 
 00:04:37.110 --> 00:04:38.432
 early-seventeen-seventies.
 
 00:04:39.072 --> 00:04:39.773
 He is not,
 
 00:04:39.853 --> 00:04:40.692
 and I think this is one of the
 
 00:04:40.733 --> 00:04:42.093
 big points I'm making in my book,
 
 00:04:42.514 --> 00:04:44.415
 he's not a devout defender
 
 00:04:44.636 --> 00:04:45.776
 of the British Empire or
 
 00:04:45.797 --> 00:04:46.797
 King and Parliament or any
 
 00:04:46.836 --> 00:04:47.697
 sort of ideology.
 
 00:04:48.478 --> 00:04:48.798
 Instead,
 
 00:04:48.838 --> 00:04:50.379
 he's a merchant who imports goods
 
 00:04:50.819 --> 00:04:52.038
 from Britain and his
 
 00:04:52.098 --> 00:04:53.838
 business is hurt very much
 
 00:04:53.999 --> 00:04:55.120
 by the non-importation
 
 00:04:55.139 --> 00:04:56.860
 agreements and being
 
 00:04:56.920 --> 00:04:58.019
 labeled someone who broke
 
 00:04:58.040 --> 00:04:59.319
 the non-importation agreement,
 
 00:04:59.379 --> 00:05:01.100
 which he denies and his
 
 00:05:01.201 --> 00:05:02.461
 cousin sticks up for him as well.
 
 00:05:03.081 --> 00:05:03.940
 But he gets labeled as
 
 00:05:04.180 --> 00:05:04.942
 someone who's breaking the
 
 00:05:04.982 --> 00:05:06.182
 non-importation agreements.
 
 00:05:06.382 --> 00:05:08.041
 So his business is boycotted,
 
 00:05:08.362 --> 00:05:10.603
 real downturn in the family's finances.
 
 00:05:11.223 --> 00:05:14.423
 And then when revolution comes in, in
 
 00:05:16.223 --> 00:05:17.305
 He and his family are some
 
 00:05:17.345 --> 00:05:19.745
 of the earliest to flee Massachusetts.
 
 00:05:20.125 --> 00:05:21.206
 They first go to Boston,
 
 00:05:21.247 --> 00:05:22.187
 like a lot of the other
 
 00:05:22.286 --> 00:05:23.648
 early Loyalists do,
 
 00:05:24.007 --> 00:05:25.968
 but they sail to Halifax in early May,
 
 00:05:26.048 --> 00:05:27.089
 the first week of May,
 
 00:05:27.170 --> 00:05:28.130
 seventeen seventy five.
 
 00:05:28.591 --> 00:05:29.932
 So this is really one of our
 
 00:05:30.112 --> 00:05:32.392
 earliest Loyalist exile families.
 
 00:05:32.413 --> 00:05:33.392
 If they're not.
 
 00:05:35.372 --> 00:05:36.634
 Diehard defenders.
 
 00:05:36.694 --> 00:05:37.595
 Why are they leaving?
 
 00:05:37.714 --> 00:05:38.254
 What happens?
 
 00:05:39.055 --> 00:05:40.076
 This is a really good question.
 
 00:05:40.235 --> 00:05:42.237
 So the reason that Thomas
 
 00:05:42.278 --> 00:05:43.377
 Roby decides to leave
 
 00:05:43.437 --> 00:05:45.120
 Massachusetts is he's in
 
 00:05:45.240 --> 00:05:47.201
 contact with his cousin, Jonathan Sewell,
 
 00:05:47.680 --> 00:05:48.661
 whose house had been
 
 00:05:48.701 --> 00:05:50.622
 ransacked during the powder alarm.
 
 00:05:51.504 --> 00:05:51.744
 Right.
 
 00:05:51.803 --> 00:05:52.904
 Who is basically the one
 
 00:05:52.964 --> 00:05:54.185
 planning to remove the
 
 00:05:54.245 --> 00:05:56.607
 family to Nova Scotia first
 
 00:05:56.666 --> 00:05:57.387
 and then to London.
 
 00:05:58.389 --> 00:06:00.050
 And that's his ultimate plan.
 
 00:06:00.730 --> 00:06:02.271
 And this is something we can
 
 00:06:02.310 --> 00:06:03.791
 talk about maybe a little bit.
 
 00:06:03.851 --> 00:06:05.232
 Thomas Roby comes from,
 
 00:06:05.331 --> 00:06:06.172
 I think Gordon Wood is
 
 00:06:06.331 --> 00:06:08.132
 right in the idea that this
 
 00:06:08.173 --> 00:06:09.492
 world of patronage was very
 
 00:06:09.512 --> 00:06:10.492
 important in
 
 00:06:10.552 --> 00:06:12.074
 pre-Revelationary Massachusetts.
 
 00:06:12.093 --> 00:06:13.434
 And Thomas Roby's most
 
 00:06:13.473 --> 00:06:14.795
 important patron is his cousin,
 
 00:06:15.115 --> 00:06:15.774
 Jonathan Sewell.
 
 00:06:16.194 --> 00:06:17.334
 this lawyer and the attorney
 
 00:06:17.375 --> 00:06:18.394
 general from Boston.
 
 00:06:18.475 --> 00:06:19.596
 He made him a justice of the
 
 00:06:19.656 --> 00:06:21.175
 peace during the seventeen
 
 00:06:21.216 --> 00:06:21.995
 sixties and seventies,
 
 00:06:22.016 --> 00:06:22.716
 which meant he didn't have
 
 00:06:22.735 --> 00:06:23.857
 to do military service,
 
 00:06:24.817 --> 00:06:25.817
 which is what Thomas Roby
 
 00:06:25.857 --> 00:06:27.656
 wants to be justice of the peace for.
 
 00:06:27.716 --> 00:06:29.858
 So he doesn't have to do military service.
 
 00:06:30.478 --> 00:06:31.298
 So he's following his
 
 00:06:31.338 --> 00:06:33.577
 cousin's advice and his cousin saying,
 
 00:06:33.598 --> 00:06:34.059
 listen, you know,
 
 00:06:34.079 --> 00:06:35.158
 our best bet is to leave
 
 00:06:35.199 --> 00:06:36.658
 here for the time and we
 
 00:06:36.699 --> 00:06:38.178
 can come back when things have died down.
 
 00:06:38.218 --> 00:06:38.759
 And of course,
 
 00:06:39.079 --> 00:06:40.899
 they imagine the empire to be successful.
 
 00:06:42.100 --> 00:06:43.362
 So that's why they leave.
 
 00:06:43.382 --> 00:06:44.041
 And they're some of the
 
 00:06:44.122 --> 00:06:45.884
 earliest refugees to Nova Scotia.
 
 00:06:46.264 --> 00:06:47.204
 This will benefit them in
 
 00:06:47.225 --> 00:06:48.766
 the long term because Roby
 
 00:06:48.786 --> 00:06:51.708
 sets himself up as a importer in Halifax.
 
 00:06:52.449 --> 00:06:54.029
 And that's really beneficial
 
 00:06:54.069 --> 00:06:55.230
 to the family because as
 
 00:06:55.271 --> 00:06:56.812
 the city becomes a
 
 00:06:56.872 --> 00:06:58.093
 destination for other
 
 00:06:58.192 --> 00:07:00.475
 exiles from the first thirteen colonies,
 
 00:07:01.076 --> 00:07:02.156
 it's his business who's
 
 00:07:02.196 --> 00:07:03.637
 established their earliest.
 
 00:07:04.218 --> 00:07:05.999
 So he'll do quite well for himself.
 
 00:07:06.059 --> 00:07:07.360
 They'll buy a really nice
 
 00:07:07.399 --> 00:07:09.321
 home in downtown Halifax.
 
 00:07:09.380 --> 00:07:11.062
 It's destroyed during the
 
 00:07:11.103 --> 00:07:12.843
 explosion in the early twentieth century.
 
 00:07:13.764 --> 00:07:15.264
 Right downtown Halifax,
 
 00:07:15.305 --> 00:07:17.226
 not far from the governor's
 
 00:07:17.247 --> 00:07:19.528
 mansion and the parade.
 
 00:07:20.028 --> 00:07:20.889
 So that's what that's what
 
 00:07:20.928 --> 00:07:21.850
 drives them into exile.
 
 00:07:21.889 --> 00:07:24.230
 Not really devout defenders of the empire,
 
 00:07:24.732 --> 00:07:25.651
 but connections, you know,
 
 00:07:25.672 --> 00:07:26.312
 these connections to
 
 00:07:26.492 --> 00:07:27.514
 important family members.
 
 00:07:27.574 --> 00:07:27.934
 Interesting.
 
 00:07:28.254 --> 00:07:29.454
 But that explosion that
 
 00:07:29.774 --> 00:07:30.755
 wiped out the house is the
 
 00:07:30.795 --> 00:07:31.795
 reason why Halifax,
 
 00:07:31.836 --> 00:07:32.737
 Nova Scotia every year
 
 00:07:32.776 --> 00:07:34.057
 gives Boston a Christmas tree.
 
 00:07:34.639 --> 00:07:36.199
 because Boston does send aid
 
 00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:37.380
 in nineteen eighty in the
 
 00:07:37.422 --> 00:07:38.401
 wake of the explosion.
 
 00:07:39.182 --> 00:07:39.803
 Exactly right.
 
 00:07:39.863 --> 00:07:40.064
 Yep.
 
 00:07:40.144 --> 00:07:41.045
 Something we remember.
 
 00:07:41.444 --> 00:07:41.605
 Yep.
 
 00:07:41.685 --> 00:07:42.706
 Lunenburg County is the
 
 00:07:42.985 --> 00:07:44.447
 Christmas tree capital of the world,
 
 00:07:44.528 --> 00:07:45.829
 as their sign famously says,
 
 00:07:45.848 --> 00:07:47.410
 if you're driving out towards Lunenburg.
 
 00:07:48.050 --> 00:07:49.432
 So they send that Christmas tree.
 
 00:07:49.451 --> 00:07:50.452
 Yes, that's exactly right.
 
 00:07:50.492 --> 00:07:52.394
 Good, good, good.
 
 00:07:52.435 --> 00:07:54.997
 So they go up to Nova Scotia and I mean,
 
 00:07:55.117 --> 00:07:55.557
 it's great.
 
 00:07:55.598 --> 00:07:57.720
 The mayor doesn't seem to
 
 00:07:57.779 --> 00:07:59.040
 like it very much.
 
 00:07:59.593 --> 00:07:59.994
 Yeah.
 
 00:08:00.053 --> 00:08:01.435
 So there's a big divide
 
 00:08:01.615 --> 00:08:03.656
 between the patriarch, Thomas Roby,
 
 00:08:03.737 --> 00:08:05.718
 and the matriarch, Mary Bradstreet Roby.
 
 00:08:05.798 --> 00:08:06.458
 I'll call her Mary
 
 00:08:06.478 --> 00:08:07.218
 Bradstreet Roby to
 
 00:08:07.418 --> 00:08:08.298
 differentiate her from her
 
 00:08:08.358 --> 00:08:10.220
 eldest daughter, who's also Mary Roby.
 
 00:08:11.401 --> 00:08:12.622
 Mary Bradstreet Roby writes
 
 00:08:12.641 --> 00:08:13.702
 this awesome letter in
 
 00:08:13.762 --> 00:08:14.742
 seventeen seventy six.
 
 00:08:15.324 --> 00:08:17.305
 So Thomas leaves Halifax and
 
 00:08:17.345 --> 00:08:18.685
 Halifax and goes to London
 
 00:08:19.086 --> 00:08:20.567
 to link up with Jonathan Sewell,
 
 00:08:20.586 --> 00:08:22.228
 who was left and to try to
 
 00:08:22.288 --> 00:08:23.749
 get a position in government.
 
 00:08:23.788 --> 00:08:24.528
 That's why he's there.
 
 00:08:24.569 --> 00:08:25.490
 He's there to petition to
 
 00:08:25.529 --> 00:08:26.509
 get some sort of petition,
 
 00:08:26.891 --> 00:08:28.791
 some place in government in Nova Scotia.
 
 00:08:29.826 --> 00:08:31.649
 And his wife writes him this
 
 00:08:31.769 --> 00:08:33.071
 awesome letter from Halifax
 
 00:08:33.731 --> 00:08:34.513
 where she complains about a
 
 00:08:34.552 --> 00:08:35.073
 lot of things.
 
 00:08:35.354 --> 00:08:36.195
 She complains about the weather.
 
 00:08:36.816 --> 00:08:38.378
 It's dark and dreary and cold.
 
 00:08:38.398 --> 00:08:38.998
 She doesn't like that.
 
 00:08:39.018 --> 00:08:40.580
 It's January of seventeen seventy six.
 
 00:08:40.980 --> 00:08:42.623
 So dark and dreary and cold.
 
 00:08:43.062 --> 00:08:44.465
 She also can't find a doctor.
 
 00:08:44.605 --> 00:08:45.505
 She has a.
 
 00:08:46.147 --> 00:08:46.407
 Like,
 
 00:08:46.927 --> 00:08:49.029
 I think a bit of a toothache and she
 
 00:08:49.049 --> 00:08:50.191
 can't find a doctor to help
 
 00:08:50.211 --> 00:08:51.010
 her with this toothache.
 
 00:08:51.030 --> 00:08:51.792
 She doesn't like that.
 
 00:08:52.312 --> 00:08:53.533
 Her exact words are she
 
 00:08:53.552 --> 00:08:55.034
 calls Nova Scotia this dumb
 
 00:08:55.095 --> 00:08:56.056
 and stupid place,
 
 00:08:56.535 --> 00:08:57.356
 which I think means that
 
 00:08:57.376 --> 00:08:58.597
 she can't find kind of the
 
 00:08:58.758 --> 00:09:00.078
 intellectual elite that she
 
 00:09:00.099 --> 00:09:01.279
 was used to conversing with.
 
 00:09:01.687 --> 00:09:03.548
 back in Marblehead.
 
 00:09:04.207 --> 00:09:06.629
 And then she goes on to also
 
 00:09:06.688 --> 00:09:07.708
 make a really interesting
 
 00:09:07.788 --> 00:09:09.190
 note that she would write
 
 00:09:09.330 --> 00:09:10.990
 more to her husband if she could,
 
 00:09:11.471 --> 00:09:12.730
 but she can't because she
 
 00:09:12.770 --> 00:09:14.871
 believes she's lost her New England head.
 
 00:09:15.152 --> 00:09:17.072
 This is the confusing that she uses.
 
 00:09:17.913 --> 00:09:18.812
 which is which is a really
 
 00:09:18.852 --> 00:09:20.053
 intriguing line I think
 
 00:09:20.433 --> 00:09:21.153
 yeah I think it shows us
 
 00:09:21.173 --> 00:09:22.173
 something important about
 
 00:09:22.214 --> 00:09:23.254
 the loyalists that's been
 
 00:09:23.294 --> 00:09:24.254
 kind of overlooked in a lot
 
 00:09:24.274 --> 00:09:25.596
 of the scholarship if
 
 00:09:25.635 --> 00:09:26.495
 you're to visit atlantic
 
 00:09:26.535 --> 00:09:28.417
 canada today at least I am
 
 00:09:28.517 --> 00:09:29.777
 of the persuasion that
 
 00:09:29.797 --> 00:09:30.716
 there's really not that
 
 00:09:30.756 --> 00:09:32.738
 much difference between new
 
 00:09:32.758 --> 00:09:33.817
 brunswick nova scotia
 
 00:09:33.918 --> 00:09:35.798
 prince edward island and uh
 
 00:09:35.979 --> 00:09:36.999
 new england right these are
 
 00:09:37.119 --> 00:09:38.320
 places that order one another
 
 00:09:38.980 --> 00:09:40.301
 The weather is fairly
 
 00:09:40.360 --> 00:09:42.162
 similar in the entire region.
 
 00:09:43.482 --> 00:09:43.842
 However,
 
 00:09:43.883 --> 00:09:45.764
 the Loyalists view themselves as
 
 00:09:45.844 --> 00:09:47.664
 removed from their ancestral home.
 
 00:09:47.784 --> 00:09:49.005
 I mean, Mary Bradstreet Robey,
 
 00:09:49.025 --> 00:09:50.145
 as you pointed out,
 
 00:09:50.466 --> 00:09:51.606
 she's related to this
 
 00:09:51.726 --> 00:09:53.967
 really prominent New England family,
 
 00:09:54.008 --> 00:09:54.908
 the Bradstreets.
 
 00:09:55.552 --> 00:09:57.494
 And being removed to this garrison town,
 
 00:09:57.553 --> 00:09:59.514
 which is Halifax in seventeen seventy six,
 
 00:09:59.534 --> 00:10:01.057
 it's basically just a military outpost.
 
 00:10:01.817 --> 00:10:03.238
 It's like removal to a
 
 00:10:03.298 --> 00:10:04.720
 foreign country or third world, really.
 
 00:10:05.620 --> 00:10:06.581
 She's none.
 
 00:10:06.600 --> 00:10:07.501
 She can find none of the
 
 00:10:07.542 --> 00:10:09.043
 luxuries of what she's used to.
 
 00:10:09.683 --> 00:10:10.364
 So this is something we
 
 00:10:10.384 --> 00:10:11.144
 should remember when
 
 00:10:11.225 --> 00:10:13.086
 thinking about the loyalist diaspora,
 
 00:10:13.586 --> 00:10:14.567
 is that even the ones who
 
 00:10:14.648 --> 00:10:16.308
 end up in places close by,
 
 00:10:17.070 --> 00:10:18.431
 they view themselves in an
 
 00:10:18.490 --> 00:10:19.572
 entirely different world.
 
 00:10:20.292 --> 00:10:21.712
 It might still be the British Empire,
 
 00:10:21.773 --> 00:10:23.374
 but it has important
 
 00:10:23.413 --> 00:10:25.315
 differences from home that
 
 00:10:25.394 --> 00:10:26.635
 really impact their character.
 
 00:10:27.076 --> 00:10:27.475
 Interesting.
 
 00:10:28.236 --> 00:10:30.317
 We're talking with G. Patrick O'Brien,
 
 00:10:30.357 --> 00:10:31.118
 assistant teaching
 
 00:10:31.158 --> 00:10:33.059
 professor at the University of Tampa,
 
 00:10:33.639 --> 00:10:35.740
 about his work on the Roby
 
 00:10:35.780 --> 00:10:38.101
 family who were exiled from Marblehead,
 
 00:10:38.962 --> 00:10:41.083
 forthcoming book, Unknown and Unlamented,
 
 00:10:41.104 --> 00:10:42.825
 The Exile and Repatriation
 
 00:10:42.845 --> 00:10:44.645
 of a Loyalist Family in the
 
 00:10:44.725 --> 00:10:45.966
 Era of the American Revolution.
 
 00:10:46.941 --> 00:10:49.342
 and so there they are and
 
 00:10:49.364 --> 00:10:51.264
 you know during the war and
 
 00:10:51.304 --> 00:10:52.346
 so how do things go for
 
 00:10:52.365 --> 00:10:54.668
 them it is really
 
 00:10:54.687 --> 00:10:55.528
 interesting to look at the
 
 00:10:55.629 --> 00:10:57.510
 diary of mary robey to kind
 
 00:10:57.530 --> 00:10:58.631
 of understand this so she's
 
 00:10:58.672 --> 00:10:59.773
 nineteen years old in the
 
 00:10:59.793 --> 00:11:00.874
 year seventeen eighty three
 
 00:11:00.933 --> 00:11:02.475
 eighty four where she's
 
 00:11:02.514 --> 00:11:03.796
 keeping this diary that is
 
 00:11:03.876 --> 00:11:04.957
 in the massachusetts
 
 00:11:05.177 --> 00:11:06.099
 historical society's
 
 00:11:06.298 --> 00:11:08.080
 archives and what's
 
 00:11:08.100 --> 00:11:08.780
 fascinating about this
 
 00:11:08.801 --> 00:11:09.981
 diary is I was just talking
 
 00:11:10.022 --> 00:11:11.003
 to a group of students
 
 00:11:11.102 --> 00:11:12.825
 yesterday in st john new brunswick
 
 00:11:13.601 --> 00:11:15.582
 And we were talking about this diary.
 
 00:11:15.623 --> 00:11:16.504
 As far as I know,
 
 00:11:17.024 --> 00:11:18.605
 it's really the only
 
 00:11:18.745 --> 00:11:20.907
 account of loyalist exile
 
 00:11:20.986 --> 00:11:22.827
 kept by a young woman
 
 00:11:23.748 --> 00:11:24.989
 anywhere in the empire.
 
 00:11:25.409 --> 00:11:27.029
 And so to get one in Halifax,
 
 00:11:27.070 --> 00:11:29.630
 Nova Scotia is really unique.
 
 00:11:30.591 --> 00:11:32.072
 What Mary Robey writes about
 
 00:11:32.511 --> 00:11:34.471
 is much like any other diarist, right?
 
 00:11:34.511 --> 00:11:35.913
 She's writing about family events.
 
 00:11:36.633 --> 00:11:37.493
 She's writing about the weather.
 
 00:11:37.832 --> 00:11:39.734
 She's writing about her visiting practices,
 
 00:11:39.793 --> 00:11:41.494
 the families that she goes and meets,
 
 00:11:41.653 --> 00:11:42.554
 most of them loyalists,
 
 00:11:42.654 --> 00:11:44.235
 most of them from Massachusetts.
 
 00:11:44.855 --> 00:11:47.436
 Mary Beth Norton notes that in London,
 
 00:11:47.936 --> 00:11:49.856
 The loyalists from different states,
 
 00:11:49.917 --> 00:11:51.177
 including from Massachusetts,
 
 00:11:51.197 --> 00:11:52.876
 tended to keep amongst themselves.
 
 00:11:52.917 --> 00:11:54.817
 This seems to be true in
 
 00:11:54.837 --> 00:11:55.597
 Nova Scotia as well.
 
 00:11:55.638 --> 00:11:56.899
 The Massachusetts loyalists
 
 00:11:57.619 --> 00:11:59.938
 are very much familiar with one another.
 
 00:11:59.958 --> 00:12:00.720
 They visit one another.
 
 00:12:01.320 --> 00:12:02.080
 But there's also something
 
 00:12:02.120 --> 00:12:04.760
 really unique going on.
 
 00:12:04.780 --> 00:12:05.620
 As a young woman,
 
 00:12:06.221 --> 00:12:07.782
 Mary Robey does a couple of
 
 00:12:07.841 --> 00:12:08.981
 things that are unique.
 
 00:12:09.621 --> 00:12:10.543
 First thing she does that
 
 00:12:10.583 --> 00:12:11.565
 really caught my attention
 
 00:12:11.664 --> 00:12:12.886
 in this diary is she
 
 00:12:12.947 --> 00:12:14.227
 attends a number of
 
 00:12:14.328 --> 00:12:17.172
 funerals in Halifax for
 
 00:12:17.231 --> 00:12:18.875
 different people whom she's never met.
 
 00:12:19.965 --> 00:12:21.466
 And she writes very clearly
 
 00:12:21.546 --> 00:12:22.365
 that the reason she's
 
 00:12:22.405 --> 00:12:24.706
 attending these funerals is because they,
 
 00:12:24.846 --> 00:12:26.768
 like her, are Loyalist refugees.
 
 00:12:27.668 --> 00:12:28.928
 She won't even use the word Loyalist,
 
 00:12:28.948 --> 00:12:29.229
 of course.
 
 00:12:29.269 --> 00:12:29.929
 That's something that's kind
 
 00:12:29.950 --> 00:12:32.010
 of created later on by petitioners.
 
 00:12:32.091 --> 00:12:33.791
 She uses the term refugees.
 
 00:12:34.971 --> 00:12:35.991
 So they are refugees,
 
 00:12:36.293 --> 00:12:37.773
 and that's what they have in common.
 
 00:12:38.833 --> 00:12:40.533
 And Roby's reflection on
 
 00:12:40.573 --> 00:12:42.414
 these funerals is super interesting.
 
 00:12:42.455 --> 00:12:43.875
 In fact, that's where the title of my book,
 
 00:12:44.096 --> 00:12:45.557
 Unknown and Unlamented, comes from.
 
 00:12:46.376 --> 00:12:47.116
 At the funeral,
 
 00:12:47.417 --> 00:12:48.638
 one young woman who's known
 
 00:12:48.778 --> 00:12:49.837
 only as Mary Wood,
 
 00:12:50.258 --> 00:12:51.677
 I'm unsure where she comes from.
 
 00:12:52.499 --> 00:12:53.558
 She has a brother and sister,
 
 00:12:53.619 --> 00:12:54.458
 but it doesn't seem like
 
 00:12:54.499 --> 00:12:56.058
 the parents are alive anymore.
 
 00:12:56.099 --> 00:12:57.299
 She's twenty six years old.
 
 00:12:58.000 --> 00:12:59.340
 She's being buried at the
 
 00:12:59.440 --> 00:13:01.081
 old burial ground in Halifax.
 
 00:13:01.780 --> 00:13:04.120
 And Mary Roby reflects on this funeral.
 
 00:13:04.201 --> 00:13:05.442
 And she writes that going to
 
 00:13:05.481 --> 00:13:07.142
 it with her sister, her younger sister,
 
 00:13:07.201 --> 00:13:07.542
 Hedy,
 
 00:13:07.621 --> 00:13:08.501
 who I'm sure we'll talk about a
 
 00:13:08.522 --> 00:13:10.623
 little bit later on going to this funeral,
 
 00:13:10.643 --> 00:13:12.763
 she imagined she would be like unmoved.
 
 00:13:13.484 --> 00:13:15.083
 But actually, it's quite the opposite.
 
 00:13:15.384 --> 00:13:16.586
 um while she's at the
 
 00:13:16.625 --> 00:13:17.667
 funeral she envisions
 
 00:13:17.706 --> 00:13:19.549
 herself uh being buried in
 
 00:13:19.629 --> 00:13:21.312
 nova scotia unknown and
 
 00:13:21.392 --> 00:13:22.553
 unlamented in a strange
 
 00:13:22.614 --> 00:13:24.876
 place wow so it's a really
 
 00:13:24.956 --> 00:13:26.499
 moving moment uh for the
 
 00:13:26.538 --> 00:13:27.460
 young mary robey and I
 
 00:13:27.480 --> 00:13:28.181
 think it tells us something
 
 00:13:28.201 --> 00:13:29.042
 really important about
 
 00:13:29.383 --> 00:13:31.245
 commonalities in emotions
 
 00:13:31.365 --> 00:13:32.667
 that are shared by the loyalists
 
 00:13:33.408 --> 00:13:34.690
 They share very little else, right?
 
 00:13:34.710 --> 00:13:34.870
 I mean,
 
 00:13:34.889 --> 00:13:36.091
 a lot of the scholarship has shown
 
 00:13:36.171 --> 00:13:37.592
 us that the Loyalists come
 
 00:13:37.633 --> 00:13:39.494
 from diverse economic backgrounds,
 
 00:13:40.174 --> 00:13:41.235
 ideological backgrounds.
 
 00:13:41.275 --> 00:13:42.336
 The name Loyalist suggests
 
 00:13:42.356 --> 00:13:43.938
 like a unified political ideology,
 
 00:13:43.958 --> 00:13:45.240
 but that is far from the truth.
 
 00:13:45.581 --> 00:13:46.441
 They squabble with one
 
 00:13:46.461 --> 00:13:47.261
 another when they're trying
 
 00:13:47.302 --> 00:13:48.263
 to make New Brunswick and
 
 00:13:48.283 --> 00:13:49.224
 Nova Scotia Loyalist
 
 00:13:49.264 --> 00:13:50.865
 colonies and religious
 
 00:13:50.885 --> 00:13:51.726
 backgrounds as well.
 
 00:13:52.226 --> 00:13:54.208
 The Robies are a Congregationalist family,
 
 00:13:54.269 --> 00:13:54.389
 right?
 
 00:13:54.409 --> 00:13:55.650
 They are descended from Puritans.
 
 00:13:55.971 --> 00:13:56.851
 But many of the people they
 
 00:13:56.892 --> 00:13:57.932
 encounter in Nova Scotia
 
 00:13:58.052 --> 00:14:00.793
 are unsurprisingly Anglicans, right?
 
 00:14:00.835 --> 00:14:01.835
 So, you know,
 
 00:14:01.855 --> 00:14:03.556
 they share very little except
 
 00:14:03.576 --> 00:14:05.518
 for the fact that they're all refugees.
 
 00:14:06.138 --> 00:14:07.158
 And I think that that's why
 
 00:14:07.438 --> 00:14:08.659
 young women and women
 
 00:14:08.779 --> 00:14:10.341
 loyalists more broadly are
 
 00:14:10.421 --> 00:14:11.902
 so important to these
 
 00:14:11.922 --> 00:14:12.962
 communities because it's
 
 00:14:13.003 --> 00:14:14.504
 loyalist women who could
 
 00:14:14.583 --> 00:14:15.504
 lean into that shared
 
 00:14:15.544 --> 00:14:17.426
 suffering and use it to
 
 00:14:17.466 --> 00:14:18.726
 build commonality with one
 
 00:14:18.746 --> 00:14:20.168
 another that actually
 
 00:14:20.227 --> 00:14:21.788
 creates the only kind of
 
 00:14:21.969 --> 00:14:23.590
 unifying theme that these
 
 00:14:23.629 --> 00:14:24.250
 loyalists share.
 
 00:14:24.961 --> 00:14:26.644
 Interesting.
 
 00:14:26.945 --> 00:14:28.506
 So you mentioned they're among the first.
 
 00:14:28.587 --> 00:14:30.530
 So how many do come
 
 00:14:30.610 --> 00:14:31.952
 eventually to Nova Scotia?
 
 00:14:31.972 --> 00:14:32.114
 I mean,
 
 00:14:32.134 --> 00:14:33.615
 how big has the community become by
 
 00:14:33.635 --> 00:14:34.878
 the time she's writing her diary?
 
 00:14:35.498 --> 00:14:38.120
 Yeah, so numbers on this kind of vary,
 
 00:14:38.700 --> 00:14:39.520
 but we're talking at least
 
 00:14:39.600 --> 00:14:40.662
 thirty thousand people.
 
 00:14:41.081 --> 00:14:41.562
 Wow.
 
 00:14:41.581 --> 00:14:42.883
 By far the largest landing
 
 00:14:42.923 --> 00:14:44.464
 place for Loyalist refugees
 
 00:14:44.504 --> 00:14:45.205
 during the American
 
 00:14:45.225 --> 00:14:47.025
 Revolution is Nova Scotia.
 
 00:14:47.046 --> 00:14:47.927
 And keep in mind that that's
 
 00:14:48.086 --> 00:14:49.748
 also counting what becomes New Brunswick,
 
 00:14:50.067 --> 00:14:50.948
 which will be separated
 
 00:14:50.989 --> 00:14:52.549
 from Nova Scotia just after
 
 00:14:52.590 --> 00:14:53.590
 the American Revolution in
 
 00:14:53.629 --> 00:14:55.272
 seventeen eighty four into its own colony,
 
 00:14:55.552 --> 00:14:57.352
 specifically for Loyalist refugees.
 
 00:14:57.913 --> 00:14:59.354
 So this this community grows
 
 00:14:59.695 --> 00:15:00.695
 and it grows very quickly.
 
 00:15:01.255 --> 00:15:02.196
 Mary Roby's diary is
 
 00:15:02.216 --> 00:15:03.356
 seventeen eighty three eighty four.
 
 00:15:03.476 --> 00:15:04.437
 So we can actually see it.
 
 00:15:04.977 --> 00:15:06.519
 She writes very clearly
 
 00:15:06.539 --> 00:15:07.461
 about the influx of
 
 00:15:07.500 --> 00:15:08.761
 refugees who are arriving.
 
 00:15:09.361 --> 00:15:10.283
 Many of them have nothing.
 
 00:15:11.443 --> 00:15:12.625
 They line up for food on
 
 00:15:12.684 --> 00:15:13.566
 board days where they're
 
 00:15:13.586 --> 00:15:14.626
 getting provisions from the
 
 00:15:14.647 --> 00:15:15.307
 British government.
 
 00:15:16.168 --> 00:15:17.409
 Many of them are without housing,
 
 00:15:17.610 --> 00:15:19.631
 which she is very clear
 
 00:15:19.652 --> 00:15:20.393
 about what that's going to
 
 00:15:20.413 --> 00:15:21.614
 be like in the long kind of
 
 00:15:21.634 --> 00:15:22.394
 Nova Scotia winter.
 
 00:15:23.394 --> 00:15:25.236
 And so she's surrounded by
 
 00:15:25.277 --> 00:15:26.177
 this kind of suffering.
 
 00:15:26.398 --> 00:15:28.000
 And it is interesting, again, because,
 
 00:15:28.320 --> 00:15:28.600
 you know,
 
 00:15:28.860 --> 00:15:30.022
 the elite loyalists like the
 
 00:15:30.042 --> 00:15:31.222
 Robies who arrived early,
 
 00:15:31.263 --> 00:15:32.844
 they're doing quite well for themselves.
 
 00:15:33.424 --> 00:15:35.105
 They try to recreate their
 
 00:15:35.145 --> 00:15:36.587
 lives prior to exile.
 
 00:15:36.988 --> 00:15:38.089
 And so they go to a number
 
 00:15:38.129 --> 00:15:39.250
 of these balls that are
 
 00:15:39.269 --> 00:15:40.652
 held at the governor's mansion and
 
 00:15:41.292 --> 00:15:42.991
 Mary Robey eventually stops going.
 
 00:15:43.572 --> 00:15:44.753
 And she writes very clearly
 
 00:15:44.773 --> 00:15:45.533
 that the reason that she
 
 00:15:45.572 --> 00:15:47.033
 doesn't go to these balls
 
 00:15:47.413 --> 00:15:48.033
 is because even though
 
 00:15:48.053 --> 00:15:48.994
 everyone looks happy,
 
 00:15:49.394 --> 00:15:50.793
 if you pull back the curtain,
 
 00:15:51.094 --> 00:15:52.934
 there's what she calls gilded misery,
 
 00:15:54.034 --> 00:15:55.635
 which is this like idea
 
 00:15:55.676 --> 00:15:56.535
 that I think is so
 
 00:15:56.576 --> 00:15:57.596
 intriguing when thinking
 
 00:15:57.615 --> 00:15:58.355
 about the loyalists.
 
 00:15:58.655 --> 00:15:59.657
 Why is it gilded?
 
 00:16:00.216 --> 00:16:01.756
 I think my argument is because once again,
 
 00:16:01.797 --> 00:16:02.756
 it's that like shared
 
 00:16:02.817 --> 00:16:04.577
 suffering that allows them
 
 00:16:04.618 --> 00:16:06.118
 to find commonality with one another.
 
 00:16:06.158 --> 00:16:07.719
 So even though it is this negative emotion,
 
 00:16:07.759 --> 00:16:08.839
 something that we try to avoid,
 
 00:16:09.239 --> 00:16:11.221
 it gave the loyalists something in common,
 
 00:16:11.280 --> 00:16:12.162
 and perhaps the only thing
 
 00:16:12.182 --> 00:16:14.004
 that they really shared in common.
 
 00:16:14.063 --> 00:16:14.524
 Interesting.
 
 00:16:15.644 --> 00:16:16.826
 You've written about another
 
 00:16:16.966 --> 00:16:18.567
 woman from Marblehead, Flora Lee.
 
 00:16:18.607 --> 00:16:19.288
 I wonder if we could just
 
 00:16:19.369 --> 00:16:20.470
 segue and talk a little bit
 
 00:16:20.509 --> 00:16:21.591
 about her story too,
 
 00:16:21.610 --> 00:16:22.331
 because that's another
 
 00:16:22.390 --> 00:16:23.773
 fascinating piece of this.
 
 00:16:24.369 --> 00:16:24.649
 Yes.
 
 00:16:24.869 --> 00:16:26.409
 So the Roby family are also
 
 00:16:26.470 --> 00:16:27.789
 slave owners as a
 
 00:16:27.850 --> 00:16:29.211
 significant number of
 
 00:16:29.350 --> 00:16:30.451
 Marblehead's population
 
 00:16:30.532 --> 00:16:32.491
 prior to the revolution was.
 
 00:16:33.913 --> 00:16:36.014
 They own a young girl who's
 
 00:16:36.073 --> 00:16:38.794
 unfortunately never named in the record.
 
 00:16:38.815 --> 00:16:40.115
 So I'm going to call her Flora's daughter,
 
 00:16:40.135 --> 00:16:41.336
 which is the only name we
 
 00:16:41.375 --> 00:16:42.135
 can really give her.
 
 00:16:43.677 --> 00:16:45.238
 That daughter had been given
 
 00:16:45.298 --> 00:16:47.818
 to them by Mary Bradstreet
 
 00:16:47.859 --> 00:16:50.379
 Roby's grandmother, Hannah Lee.
 
 00:16:51.201 --> 00:16:52.201
 who is related to the Lee
 
 00:16:52.221 --> 00:16:53.884
 family of Marblehead.
 
 00:16:54.524 --> 00:16:56.927
 And so Flora Lee was
 
 00:16:57.649 --> 00:16:59.390
 obviously Flora's daughter's mother.
 
 00:16:59.951 --> 00:17:01.393
 And when the revolution breaks out,
 
 00:17:01.533 --> 00:17:02.995
 the Robies flee Marblehead
 
 00:17:03.054 --> 00:17:05.218
 and they take with them Flora's daughter.
 
 00:17:05.998 --> 00:17:07.259
 They bring her to Nova Scotia,
 
 00:17:07.358 --> 00:17:09.339
 but Flora remains behind in
 
 00:17:09.440 --> 00:17:11.922
 Marblehead in Hannah Lee's home.
 
 00:17:12.701 --> 00:17:14.202
 And there's one really good record,
 
 00:17:14.363 --> 00:17:15.383
 the only time that Flora
 
 00:17:15.423 --> 00:17:16.844
 Lee's voice really
 
 00:17:17.183 --> 00:17:18.305
 penetrates the archive.
 
 00:17:19.465 --> 00:17:21.446
 In a postscript on one letter,
 
 00:17:21.846 --> 00:17:24.929
 Hannah Lee wrote to Nova Scotia,
 
 00:17:25.308 --> 00:17:26.970
 Flora sends her duty to you
 
 00:17:27.150 --> 00:17:28.471
 and her love to her child.
 
 00:17:29.171 --> 00:17:31.813
 which is this kind of really powerful note,
 
 00:17:31.833 --> 00:17:33.334
 I think shows us a couple of things.
 
 00:17:33.795 --> 00:17:34.255
 First of all,
 
 00:17:34.275 --> 00:17:36.236
 this is clearly a sign of
 
 00:17:36.977 --> 00:17:38.238
 Flora's continued thought
 
 00:17:38.298 --> 00:17:39.419
 and love for this daughter
 
 00:17:39.439 --> 00:17:40.519
 who had been spirited away
 
 00:17:40.558 --> 00:17:42.480
 from her because of the revolution,
 
 00:17:42.540 --> 00:17:43.922
 due to no fault of their own.
 
 00:17:45.103 --> 00:17:46.483
 These people didn't choose allegiance.
 
 00:17:46.943 --> 00:17:48.805
 It was forced upon them by
 
 00:17:49.306 --> 00:17:50.487
 the families who enslaved them.
 
 00:17:51.748 --> 00:17:53.068
 And it also shows this like
 
 00:17:53.128 --> 00:17:54.411
 act of deference on the
 
 00:17:54.431 --> 00:17:56.413
 part of Flora Lee to the Robey family.
 
 00:17:56.794 --> 00:17:57.314
 Basically, you know,
 
 00:17:57.334 --> 00:17:58.336
 she sends her duty to you,
 
 00:17:58.375 --> 00:17:58.875
 this kind of like
 
 00:17:58.935 --> 00:18:01.138
 obligation and respect that
 
 00:18:01.179 --> 00:18:02.601
 perhaps was also meant as a
 
 00:18:02.681 --> 00:18:03.981
 sign to the Robey's about
 
 00:18:04.042 --> 00:18:06.125
 like her continued attempts
 
 00:18:06.164 --> 00:18:07.747
 to get her daughter back.
 
 00:18:08.422 --> 00:18:09.442
 And she does, actually.
 
 00:18:09.481 --> 00:18:11.103
 We don't know exactly how this happens.
 
 00:18:11.482 --> 00:18:12.723
 But by seventeen eighty four,
 
 00:18:13.124 --> 00:18:15.104
 Flora Lee is in Nova Scotia.
 
 00:18:15.144 --> 00:18:16.605
 She's in Halifax living and
 
 00:18:16.664 --> 00:18:18.526
 working in the Roby family's home.
 
 00:18:19.066 --> 00:18:19.986
 Hannah Lee had died in
 
 00:18:20.486 --> 00:18:21.326
 seventeen eighty one.
 
 00:18:21.707 --> 00:18:22.547
 And in her will,
 
 00:18:22.586 --> 00:18:24.407
 she does bequeath money and
 
 00:18:24.548 --> 00:18:25.887
 items to Flora Lee.
 
 00:18:26.269 --> 00:18:28.068
 So this was like effective emancipation.
 
 00:18:28.169 --> 00:18:29.150
 Nothing in the will says I'm
 
 00:18:29.190 --> 00:18:29.890
 emancipating you.
 
 00:18:30.549 --> 00:18:32.451
 As was common around this time,
 
 00:18:32.730 --> 00:18:34.792
 this worked as an emancipation statement.
 
 00:18:35.212 --> 00:18:36.252
 And so Flora Lee probably
 
 00:18:36.314 --> 00:18:37.894
 sold what she was left and
 
 00:18:37.953 --> 00:18:39.634
 found passage to Nova Scotia.
 
 00:18:40.115 --> 00:18:40.355
 Yeah,
 
 00:18:40.395 --> 00:18:41.876
 where she's actually reunited with
 
 00:18:41.896 --> 00:18:43.577
 that daughter for a short period of time.
 
 00:18:43.958 --> 00:18:45.979
 The daughter will die in the
 
 00:18:46.019 --> 00:18:46.700
 seventeen eighty three
 
 00:18:46.960 --> 00:18:48.340
 eighty four period of measles,
 
 00:18:48.361 --> 00:18:49.981
 an outbreak that plagues
 
 00:18:50.041 --> 00:18:51.762
 Halifax during the Loyalist arrival.
 
 00:18:52.482 --> 00:18:53.564
 But Flora will actually
 
 00:18:53.604 --> 00:18:54.545
 spend a lot of her time in
 
 00:18:54.585 --> 00:18:56.326
 Halifax adopting a number
 
 00:18:56.445 --> 00:18:59.428
 of other young children, Black refugees,
 
 00:18:59.448 --> 00:19:00.269
 Black loyalists.
 
 00:19:00.949 --> 00:19:02.770
 It's unclear what their backgrounds were,
 
 00:19:03.191 --> 00:19:04.652
 but the diary leads us to
 
 00:19:04.711 --> 00:19:05.952
 suggest that many of them
 
 00:19:05.992 --> 00:19:07.673
 were either orphaned or
 
 00:19:07.733 --> 00:19:08.795
 living on the kind of
 
 00:19:08.914 --> 00:19:09.996
 porous boundary between
 
 00:19:10.036 --> 00:19:10.916
 slavery and freedom.
 
 00:19:11.436 --> 00:19:12.518
 A lot of Black loyalists who
 
 00:19:12.597 --> 00:19:13.739
 end up in Nova Scotia
 
 00:19:14.618 --> 00:19:16.240
 suffer re-enslavement,
 
 00:19:16.621 --> 00:19:17.480
 even though many of them
 
 00:19:17.520 --> 00:19:18.582
 are freed by the British
 
 00:19:18.602 --> 00:19:20.584
 Empire and sold to the Caribbean.
 
 00:19:21.104 --> 00:19:22.265
 So there's a possibility.
 
 00:19:22.305 --> 00:19:22.505
 Yeah,
 
 00:19:22.525 --> 00:19:23.945
 there's a possibility that what Flora
 
 00:19:24.046 --> 00:19:25.086
 Lee is doing is bringing
 
 00:19:25.106 --> 00:19:26.888
 these children into the Roby family home,
 
 00:19:26.909 --> 00:19:27.509
 which is, of course,
 
 00:19:27.568 --> 00:19:29.269
 subjecting them back to enslavement.
 
 00:19:29.931 --> 00:19:30.971
 The Robys will refer to
 
 00:19:30.991 --> 00:19:33.232
 these children and Flora as a servant.
 
 00:19:34.213 --> 00:19:35.855
 But that's probably a
 
 00:19:36.115 --> 00:19:37.817
 rhetorical trick in order
 
 00:19:38.057 --> 00:19:39.657
 if the Halifax or the Nova
 
 00:19:39.678 --> 00:19:41.359
 Scotia legislator abolishes slavery.
 
 00:19:41.839 --> 00:19:43.622
 they haven't abolished servitude, right?
 
 00:19:43.761 --> 00:19:45.023
 And so this is probably like
 
 00:19:45.044 --> 00:19:46.484
 a rhetorical tool to keep
 
 00:19:46.505 --> 00:19:47.727
 people enslaved.
 
 00:19:48.007 --> 00:19:49.709
 But it is a form of protection, right?
 
 00:19:49.749 --> 00:19:50.690
 If Floralee can bring them
 
 00:19:50.710 --> 00:19:51.871
 into the Robey family home,
 
 00:19:52.192 --> 00:19:53.353
 then they're not subject to
 
 00:19:53.393 --> 00:19:55.214
 being sold to slavery into the Caribbean.
 
 00:19:55.875 --> 00:19:57.357
 And as I'm sure we're also going to go,
 
 00:19:57.857 --> 00:19:59.279
 the Robey family comes back
 
 00:19:59.640 --> 00:20:01.480
 to Massachusetts after the war,
 
 00:20:01.641 --> 00:20:04.082
 and so too does Flora and these children.
 
 00:20:04.821 --> 00:20:05.883
 And many of them go on to
 
 00:20:05.903 --> 00:20:08.884
 have apprenticeships in Massachusetts and,
 
 00:20:09.223 --> 00:20:09.804
 interestingly enough,
 
 00:20:09.824 --> 00:20:11.105
 back in Nova Scotia as well,
 
 00:20:11.525 --> 00:20:13.045
 apprenticeships with
 
 00:20:13.144 --> 00:20:15.405
 different occupations that
 
 00:20:15.465 --> 00:20:16.666
 Flora would have imagined
 
 00:20:16.946 --> 00:20:18.027
 would put these children on
 
 00:20:18.067 --> 00:20:19.948
 a path to freedom and stability.
 
 00:20:20.407 --> 00:20:21.128
 Flora never does.
 
 00:20:21.169 --> 00:20:22.068
 She lives and works in the
 
 00:20:22.088 --> 00:20:23.148
 Robies family's home and
 
 00:20:23.169 --> 00:20:24.049
 the Sewell family home
 
 00:20:24.450 --> 00:20:25.609
 through her death in the
 
 00:20:25.650 --> 00:20:26.691
 early nineteenth century.
 
 00:20:26.990 --> 00:20:28.371
 But it is an amazing story
 
 00:20:28.471 --> 00:20:29.852
 about Loyalist slavery and
 
 00:20:29.892 --> 00:20:30.592
 its resistance.
 
 00:20:30.652 --> 00:20:31.471
 I think Flora's story of
 
 00:20:31.511 --> 00:20:32.873
 resistance is really important.
 
 00:20:33.553 --> 00:20:33.873
 It is.
 
 00:20:33.932 --> 00:20:34.653
 Thank you.
 
 00:20:34.712 --> 00:20:36.534
 We're talking with Patrick O'Brien,
 
 00:20:36.574 --> 00:20:37.294
 assistant teaching
 
 00:20:37.314 --> 00:20:39.154
 professor at the University of Tampa,
 
 00:20:41.056 --> 00:20:42.395
 writing the forthcoming book,
 
 00:20:42.455 --> 00:20:43.476
 Unknown and Unlamented,
 
 00:20:43.496 --> 00:20:45.116
 The Exile and Repatriation
 
 00:20:45.156 --> 00:20:46.537
 of a Loyalist Family in the
 
 00:20:46.636 --> 00:20:48.198
 Era of the American Revolution,
 
 00:20:48.258 --> 00:20:48.857
 talking about this
 
 00:20:50.419 --> 00:20:52.679
 connection with Nova Scotia.
 
 00:20:54.079 --> 00:20:54.259
 So
 
 00:20:55.748 --> 00:20:57.769
 Before we get to how they do
 
 00:20:57.788 --> 00:20:59.691
 start coming back, I'm still curious,
 
 00:20:59.990 --> 00:21:00.731
 Roby Street,
 
 00:21:00.751 --> 00:21:04.334
 so apparently some Robys stayed.
 
 00:21:04.493 --> 00:21:04.894
 Yes.
 
 00:21:05.095 --> 00:21:08.797
 So Simon Bradstreet Roby is
 
 00:21:08.876 --> 00:21:10.597
 the eldest Roby's son.
 
 00:21:10.637 --> 00:21:11.878
 There's five children total,
 
 00:21:12.058 --> 00:21:14.280
 one of whom is born in Nova Scotia,
 
 00:21:14.300 --> 00:21:15.682
 the youngest, Hannah Roby.
 
 00:21:16.082 --> 00:21:18.304
 But there's five children total, Mary,
 
 00:21:18.544 --> 00:21:20.945
 Hedy, Simon Bradstreet, Thomas,
 
 00:21:21.066 --> 00:21:21.605
 and Hannah.
 
 00:21:22.446 --> 00:21:24.087
 Simon Bradstreet Roby will
 
 00:21:24.167 --> 00:21:25.469
 stay in Nova Scotia
 
 00:21:25.848 --> 00:21:27.430
 Even after the family repatriates,
 
 00:21:27.490 --> 00:21:29.172
 he studies law in his
 
 00:21:29.231 --> 00:21:32.054
 brother-in-law's law office in Halifax.
 
 00:21:32.074 --> 00:21:33.734
 And he'll go on to be a
 
 00:21:33.855 --> 00:21:35.496
 prominent member of the
 
 00:21:35.536 --> 00:21:36.676
 Nova Scotia legislator.
 
 00:21:37.117 --> 00:21:38.198
 He's a speaker of the House
 
 00:21:38.719 --> 00:21:39.479
 in the Nova Scotia
 
 00:21:39.499 --> 00:21:40.901
 legislator multiple times.
 
 00:21:41.240 --> 00:21:42.060
 And so there's a couple of
 
 00:21:42.080 --> 00:21:43.682
 streets named after him, one in Halifax,
 
 00:21:44.303 --> 00:21:46.124
 one, I believe it's in Truro, Nova Scotia,
 
 00:21:46.144 --> 00:21:46.865
 which is where he ends up
 
 00:21:46.884 --> 00:21:48.405
 spending a decent amount of his time.
 
 00:21:48.605 --> 00:21:50.428
 And I believe one in Annapolis as well.
 
 00:21:51.288 --> 00:21:52.729
 all named after the Robie
 
 00:21:52.749 --> 00:21:53.909
 who remains and plays an
 
 00:21:53.949 --> 00:21:55.730
 important role in colonial politics.
 
 00:21:56.150 --> 00:21:57.270
 But as is worth noting,
 
 00:21:57.730 --> 00:21:58.892
 he's also sending a lot of
 
 00:21:58.932 --> 00:22:00.152
 his money that he's making
 
 00:22:00.192 --> 00:22:01.133
 in Nova Scotia to
 
 00:22:01.173 --> 00:22:02.613
 Massachusetts to aid
 
 00:22:02.653 --> 00:22:03.713
 members of the family who
 
 00:22:03.733 --> 00:22:05.555
 will go back to Massachusetts.
 
 00:22:05.575 --> 00:22:06.954
 So there's an interesting story here,
 
 00:22:07.336 --> 00:22:08.576
 even before the explosion
 
 00:22:08.615 --> 00:22:10.356
 in the early twentieth century, about,
 
 00:22:10.396 --> 00:22:10.656
 you know,
 
 00:22:10.957 --> 00:22:12.498
 aid traveling back and forth
 
 00:22:12.518 --> 00:22:14.199
 between Nova Scotia.
 
 00:22:14.578 --> 00:22:15.499
 A lot of people imagine that
 
 00:22:15.519 --> 00:22:16.819
 the revolution created this like
 
 00:22:17.644 --> 00:22:19.288
 firm border between Atlantic
 
 00:22:19.327 --> 00:22:20.068
 Canada and the British
 
 00:22:20.148 --> 00:22:21.832
 Empire and New England in
 
 00:22:21.872 --> 00:22:22.772
 the American states.
 
 00:22:23.073 --> 00:22:24.214
 But I think there's actually
 
 00:22:24.234 --> 00:22:26.258
 a lot of movement of people, ideas,
 
 00:22:26.358 --> 00:22:28.040
 money back and forth across
 
 00:22:28.080 --> 00:22:29.584
 this divide throughout the
 
 00:22:29.624 --> 00:22:30.704
 nineteenth century and into
 
 00:22:30.744 --> 00:22:31.165
 the twentieth.
 
 00:22:32.959 --> 00:22:33.640
 And you really make the
 
 00:22:33.680 --> 00:22:34.721
 point that a lot of this
 
 00:22:34.941 --> 00:22:36.122
 continuing connection comes
 
 00:22:36.142 --> 00:22:36.823
 from the women in the
 
 00:22:36.863 --> 00:22:39.164
 family who are writing to one another.
 
 00:22:39.605 --> 00:22:41.326
 And even Simon Bradstreet's mother, I mean,
 
 00:22:41.346 --> 00:22:42.127
 she's going back to
 
 00:22:42.167 --> 00:22:43.429
 Massachusetts and now he's
 
 00:22:43.449 --> 00:22:44.871
 a rising political figure
 
 00:22:44.891 --> 00:22:45.611
 and she's writing to him.
 
 00:22:45.631 --> 00:22:46.571
 Well, why don't you come here?
 
 00:22:46.652 --> 00:22:48.054
 You know, give up your law practice.
 
 00:22:48.094 --> 00:22:49.174
 You wouldn't be better off
 
 00:22:49.194 --> 00:22:51.037
 here when clearly his life is there.
 
 00:22:51.740 --> 00:22:52.461
 Yes, yeah.
 
 00:22:52.761 --> 00:22:54.242
 So the way that they come
 
 00:22:54.262 --> 00:22:56.324
 back to the States is very interesting.
 
 00:22:56.903 --> 00:22:58.545
 It's clear that Mary Bradstreet Robey,
 
 00:22:58.565 --> 00:22:59.865
 the matriarch of the family,
 
 00:23:00.086 --> 00:23:01.307
 has never liked Halifax,
 
 00:23:01.646 --> 00:23:03.188
 has always been looking
 
 00:23:03.228 --> 00:23:05.230
 back to Massachusetts, and peace in
 
 00:23:07.711 --> 00:23:07.971
 Of course,
 
 00:23:08.010 --> 00:23:09.531
 Thomas Roby is very worried about this.
 
 00:23:09.692 --> 00:23:11.173
 He is named in the
 
 00:23:11.192 --> 00:23:12.814
 Banishment Act of seventeen eighty eight.
 
 00:23:12.834 --> 00:23:14.174
 So it's not like he's
 
 00:23:14.214 --> 00:23:15.295
 someone who might be able to come back.
 
 00:23:15.335 --> 00:23:15.494
 I mean,
 
 00:23:15.535 --> 00:23:16.796
 he is explicitly named in the
 
 00:23:16.836 --> 00:23:17.435
 Banishment Act.
 
 00:23:17.675 --> 00:23:19.076
 Their property is confiscated.
 
 00:23:19.837 --> 00:23:21.117
 He's buying land in
 
 00:23:21.198 --> 00:23:22.598
 neighboring New Brunswick,
 
 00:23:22.659 --> 00:23:24.299
 along with his cousin, Jonathan Sewell.
 
 00:23:24.640 --> 00:23:25.881
 So his vision is clearly for
 
 00:23:25.901 --> 00:23:28.281
 the family to remain in Nova Scotia.
 
 00:23:28.821 --> 00:23:29.863
 But Mary Bradstreet Roby
 
 00:23:29.903 --> 00:23:30.863
 convinces her husband in
 
 00:23:30.903 --> 00:23:32.023
 seventeen eighty four after
 
 00:23:32.064 --> 00:23:33.684
 the birth of her last child, Anna.
 
 00:23:34.224 --> 00:23:36.127
 that for her own health and
 
 00:23:36.147 --> 00:23:36.909
 the baby's health,
 
 00:23:36.990 --> 00:23:38.912
 she has to travel back to New England.
 
 00:23:39.532 --> 00:23:40.535
 And so he allows this.
 
 00:23:40.674 --> 00:23:42.597
 And in the summer of seventeen eighty four,
 
 00:23:43.019 --> 00:23:44.740
 the Roby family returns to
 
 00:23:45.082 --> 00:23:46.103
 Massachusetts for the first
 
 00:23:46.143 --> 00:23:47.164
 time since they had fled in
 
 00:23:47.204 --> 00:23:48.046
 seventeen seventy five,
 
 00:23:48.066 --> 00:23:49.428
 basically a decade before.
 
 00:23:50.169 --> 00:23:51.830
 And from the moment she arrives,
 
 00:23:52.211 --> 00:23:53.271
 Mary Bradstreet Robey
 
 00:23:53.311 --> 00:23:54.272
 writes things back to her
 
 00:23:54.313 --> 00:23:55.614
 husband along the lines of,
 
 00:23:55.874 --> 00:23:57.015
 and I'm paraphrasing here,
 
 00:23:57.035 --> 00:23:58.896
 but I'm almost exactly to the source.
 
 00:23:59.377 --> 00:24:00.459
 You must come here for I
 
 00:24:00.479 --> 00:24:01.660
 shall never be content to
 
 00:24:01.720 --> 00:24:03.942
 live as I have done there.
 
 00:24:03.981 --> 00:24:05.762
 So she will return in later, before
 
 00:24:07.805 --> 00:24:08.685
 But that is the first of
 
 00:24:08.786 --> 00:24:09.865
 three trips that she makes
 
 00:24:09.905 --> 00:24:10.707
 back to New England.
 
 00:24:11.007 --> 00:24:12.387
 Before in seventeen eighty eight,
 
 00:24:12.688 --> 00:24:14.388
 she is able to get her eldest daughter,
 
 00:24:14.429 --> 00:24:15.108
 Mary Roby,
 
 00:24:15.710 --> 00:24:17.550
 to marry a distant relative
 
 00:24:17.750 --> 00:24:19.010
 also in the Sewell family.
 
 00:24:19.432 --> 00:24:20.791
 And that gives her and the
 
 00:24:20.832 --> 00:24:22.053
 family a more permanent
 
 00:24:22.093 --> 00:24:23.493
 connection in Massachusetts,
 
 00:24:23.913 --> 00:24:24.855
 where she will be a little
 
 00:24:24.875 --> 00:24:25.855
 bit more forceful with her
 
 00:24:25.894 --> 00:24:27.195
 husband that now that
 
 00:24:27.215 --> 00:24:28.176
 there's a marriage and now
 
 00:24:28.196 --> 00:24:28.856
 that there's a firm
 
 00:24:28.896 --> 00:24:29.958
 connection to Marblehead,
 
 00:24:30.278 --> 00:24:32.078
 the family's future is in Massachusetts,
 
 00:24:32.118 --> 00:24:32.919
 not Nova Scotia.
 
 00:24:33.400 --> 00:24:34.539
 And so the entire family,
 
 00:24:34.660 --> 00:24:35.961
 except for Marblehead,
 
 00:24:36.561 --> 00:24:38.182
 One daughter, Hedy, who is now married,
 
 00:24:38.201 --> 00:24:39.123
 she's now Hedy Stearns,
 
 00:24:40.002 --> 00:24:41.042
 and Simon Bradstreet.
 
 00:24:41.083 --> 00:24:42.203
 They'll remain in Nova Scotia,
 
 00:24:42.503 --> 00:24:44.423
 but Thomas Robey, Mary Bradstreet Robey,
 
 00:24:44.483 --> 00:24:46.464
 now Mary Sewell, Thomas Robey,
 
 00:24:46.625 --> 00:24:47.785
 and Hannah Robey will all
 
 00:24:47.825 --> 00:24:49.184
 come back to Massachusetts,
 
 00:24:49.605 --> 00:24:50.365
 beginning this really
 
 00:24:50.425 --> 00:24:51.226
 interesting period where
 
 00:24:51.266 --> 00:24:52.746
 the family's writing back and forth.
 
 00:24:53.205 --> 00:24:54.027
 The New England family
 
 00:24:54.067 --> 00:24:54.967
 trying to convince those
 
 00:24:55.007 --> 00:24:56.146
 who remain in Nova Scotia
 
 00:24:56.426 --> 00:24:57.768
 to come back and join them
 
 00:24:57.988 --> 00:24:58.827
 in Massachusetts.
 
 00:25:00.406 --> 00:25:01.048
 And they have these really
 
 00:25:01.067 --> 00:25:02.670
 interesting connections, like Esther,
 
 00:25:02.710 --> 00:25:03.631
 Quincy, Sewell,
 
 00:25:03.730 --> 00:25:06.673
 and then one of them stays
 
 00:25:06.733 --> 00:25:09.176
 in the home of Dorothy
 
 00:25:09.356 --> 00:25:11.539
 Quincy Hancock Scott,
 
 00:25:11.700 --> 00:25:13.281
 the widow of John Hancock,
 
 00:25:13.321 --> 00:25:14.383
 who's living in the Hancock
 
 00:25:14.423 --> 00:25:15.403
 mansion on Beacon Hill.
 
 00:25:15.443 --> 00:25:17.266
 So you have the exiled
 
 00:25:17.286 --> 00:25:18.367
 family coming back and
 
 00:25:18.407 --> 00:25:21.030
 staying in the home of John Hancock.
 
 00:25:21.553 --> 00:25:22.133
 Yes, yes.
 
 00:25:22.153 --> 00:25:26.035
 So that is the wife of Jonathan Sewell,
 
 00:25:26.055 --> 00:25:27.276
 who after his death comes
 
 00:25:27.296 --> 00:25:27.996
 back and stays in
 
 00:25:28.036 --> 00:25:30.257
 Massachusetts with Esther Quincy,
 
 00:25:30.436 --> 00:25:31.817
 who she is related to.
 
 00:25:32.238 --> 00:25:33.238
 And so there's this, you know,
 
 00:25:33.298 --> 00:25:34.679
 there's this really interesting stories.
 
 00:25:34.699 --> 00:25:34.939
 Of course,
 
 00:25:34.959 --> 00:25:36.319
 we're talking about elite loyalists here,
 
 00:25:36.380 --> 00:25:36.500
 right?
 
 00:25:36.519 --> 00:25:36.720
 I mean,
 
 00:25:36.740 --> 00:25:38.080
 the Robies were and the
 
 00:25:38.121 --> 00:25:39.201
 Bradstreet's were connected
 
 00:25:39.240 --> 00:25:40.442
 to the kind of upper echelons,
 
 00:25:40.501 --> 00:25:42.083
 although like not the highest levels,
 
 00:25:42.542 --> 00:25:43.403
 but were connected to
 
 00:25:43.522 --> 00:25:45.104
 well-to-do New Englanders.
 
 00:25:45.163 --> 00:25:46.464
 So you can see that come out
 
 00:25:46.865 --> 00:25:47.924
 in their writings and in
 
 00:25:47.984 --> 00:25:49.145
 the networks that they ran in.
 
 00:25:49.486 --> 00:25:50.385
 which I think is where kind
 
 00:25:50.425 --> 00:25:51.605
 of part of my argument
 
 00:25:51.906 --> 00:25:52.926
 differs from what Gordon
 
 00:25:52.967 --> 00:25:54.166
 Wood says about patronage.
 
 00:25:54.186 --> 00:25:54.406
 You know,
 
 00:25:54.686 --> 00:25:56.007
 he says that it's a destruction
 
 00:25:56.047 --> 00:25:56.606
 of patronage.
 
 00:25:56.666 --> 00:25:57.147
 I say, well,
 
 00:25:57.188 --> 00:25:57.627
 maybe it's just a
 
 00:25:57.708 --> 00:25:58.667
 reorientation of what
 
 00:25:58.708 --> 00:25:59.807
 patronage looks like and
 
 00:25:59.827 --> 00:26:01.248
 who the patrons are, right?
 
 00:26:01.268 --> 00:26:02.388
 It's no longer the sewells
 
 00:26:02.409 --> 00:26:04.449
 like it had been prior to the revolution.
 
 00:26:04.489 --> 00:26:05.808
 Now it's a different group of sewells.
 
 00:26:06.088 --> 00:26:06.710
 He's a patriot,
 
 00:26:06.730 --> 00:26:08.130
 American connected sewells
 
 00:26:08.230 --> 00:26:09.269
 that are the patrons.
 
 00:26:09.470 --> 00:26:11.009
 And the Robies understand this, right?
 
 00:26:11.289 --> 00:26:12.270
 They are now deferential
 
 00:26:12.290 --> 00:26:13.671
 when they come back to this
 
 00:26:13.790 --> 00:26:15.810
 new order that exists in Massachusetts,
 
 00:26:16.211 --> 00:26:17.692
 not the old one, but this new one.
 
 00:26:17.991 --> 00:26:18.132
 So
 
 00:26:18.811 --> 00:26:19.531
 You know, things change,
 
 00:26:19.551 --> 00:26:20.392
 but the more things change,
 
 00:26:20.432 --> 00:26:21.432
 I think the more they might
 
 00:26:21.472 --> 00:26:22.073
 stay the same.
 
 00:26:22.353 --> 00:26:23.873
 The lawyers show us a bit about that.
 
 00:26:24.713 --> 00:26:25.334
 Interesting.
 
 00:26:25.374 --> 00:26:26.213
 We're talking with Patrick
 
 00:26:26.273 --> 00:26:28.534
 O'Brien from the University of Tampa.
 
 00:26:29.355 --> 00:26:30.815
 And so there is this attempt
 
 00:26:30.835 --> 00:26:31.954
 to reestablish a business
 
 00:26:31.994 --> 00:26:33.236
 connection with opening a
 
 00:26:33.296 --> 00:26:34.455
 shop here that will sell
 
 00:26:34.496 --> 00:26:36.916
 goods that Thomas Robey is bringing in.
 
 00:26:37.416 --> 00:26:38.196
 How does that work out?
 
 00:26:38.911 --> 00:26:39.912
 So I love this line.
 
 00:26:40.272 --> 00:26:42.095
 It comes from shortly after
 
 00:26:42.134 --> 00:26:44.198
 Thomas Roby dies in eighteen oh eight.
 
 00:26:44.858 --> 00:26:46.000
 His neighbor and a really
 
 00:26:46.340 --> 00:26:48.103
 prominent diarist in Salem
 
 00:26:48.542 --> 00:26:50.645
 writes about his friend Thomas Roby,
 
 00:26:50.685 --> 00:26:51.626
 who he didn't know when he
 
 00:26:51.646 --> 00:26:52.188
 was a loyalist.
 
 00:26:52.208 --> 00:26:52.788
 Like he's very clear.
 
 00:26:52.808 --> 00:26:53.450
 He didn't know about him
 
 00:26:53.490 --> 00:26:54.230
 until he came back.
 
 00:26:54.750 --> 00:26:55.631
 after the revolution.
 
 00:26:56.510 --> 00:26:57.811
 But he was able to procure
 
 00:26:58.392 --> 00:26:59.832
 the things that weren't fashionable,
 
 00:27:00.112 --> 00:27:00.913
 but had once been
 
 00:27:00.952 --> 00:27:03.792
 fashionable in New England.
 
 00:27:03.833 --> 00:27:04.993
 So he basically says like, you know,
 
 00:27:05.013 --> 00:27:06.134
 this is a guy who was once
 
 00:27:06.233 --> 00:27:07.294
 really good at business and
 
 00:27:07.314 --> 00:27:08.734
 is now not as good at business,
 
 00:27:08.775 --> 00:27:10.315
 but he still procures nice
 
 00:27:10.335 --> 00:27:11.134
 things that some people
 
 00:27:11.194 --> 00:27:12.174
 want every now and then.
 
 00:27:12.895 --> 00:27:13.536
 And what is really
 
 00:27:13.576 --> 00:27:14.415
 interesting about Thomas
 
 00:27:14.476 --> 00:27:16.696
 Roby is that he does figure
 
 00:27:16.777 --> 00:27:17.997
 somewhat in the literature
 
 00:27:18.017 --> 00:27:19.336
 about repatriating loyalists.
 
 00:27:19.356 --> 00:27:19.997
 And there's actually very
 
 00:27:20.017 --> 00:27:21.178
 little written about the
 
 00:27:21.198 --> 00:27:22.178
 loyalists who return.
 
 00:27:22.678 --> 00:27:23.778
 But Thomas Roby is there,
 
 00:27:24.117 --> 00:27:25.199
 and he's often used as an
 
 00:27:25.259 --> 00:27:26.778
 example to suggest that the
 
 00:27:26.818 --> 00:27:27.980
 loyalists who could return
 
 00:27:28.000 --> 00:27:29.920
 from exile were those who
 
 00:27:29.960 --> 00:27:31.701
 had important business connections.
 
 00:27:32.161 --> 00:27:32.580
 So basically,
 
 00:27:32.601 --> 00:27:33.381
 the people of Marblehead
 
 00:27:33.421 --> 00:27:34.480
 allowed Thomas Roby to come
 
 00:27:34.500 --> 00:27:35.842
 back because he could find
 
 00:27:35.862 --> 00:27:36.582
 them the things that they
 
 00:27:36.602 --> 00:27:38.102
 were missing since the Revolution.
 
 00:27:39.222 --> 00:27:39.903
 But actually,
 
 00:27:39.942 --> 00:27:41.482
 the writings of Thomas Roby
 
 00:27:41.522 --> 00:27:42.483
 and others around him
 
 00:27:42.544 --> 00:27:43.804
 suggest the complete opposite.
 
 00:27:44.243 --> 00:27:44.644
 First of all,
 
 00:27:44.683 --> 00:27:45.604
 that home that they had on
 
 00:27:45.663 --> 00:27:46.424
 Washington Street,
 
 00:27:46.484 --> 00:27:47.464
 they never recovered that.
 
 00:27:48.330 --> 00:27:49.311
 It had been confiscated.
 
 00:27:49.352 --> 00:27:50.133
 It had been taken.
 
 00:27:50.634 --> 00:27:52.375
 And they lose a lawsuit to get it back.
 
 00:27:52.737 --> 00:27:53.657
 So Marblehead's not
 
 00:27:53.738 --> 00:27:54.558
 interested in having him
 
 00:27:54.598 --> 00:27:55.480
 return to Marblehead.
 
 00:27:55.500 --> 00:27:56.962
 They actually set up a neighboring Salem.
 
 00:27:57.442 --> 00:27:58.285
 They can never really come
 
 00:27:58.305 --> 00:27:59.046
 back to Marblehead.
 
 00:27:59.066 --> 00:27:59.205
 Yep.
 
 00:27:59.605 --> 00:28:00.468
 So they don't come to Marblehead.
 
 00:28:00.488 --> 00:28:01.107
 They go to Salem.
 
 00:28:01.608 --> 00:28:03.171
 And the shop that Thomas Robey...
 
 00:28:03.892 --> 00:28:07.237
 operates in Salem is a shell
 
 00:28:07.436 --> 00:28:08.518
 of the one that he had run
 
 00:28:08.679 --> 00:28:10.099
 in Marblehead prior to the war.
 
 00:28:10.500 --> 00:28:11.402
 He's constantly in his
 
 00:28:11.442 --> 00:28:12.784
 advertisements in the newspaper,
 
 00:28:13.325 --> 00:28:14.666
 advertising different goods,
 
 00:28:14.807 --> 00:28:16.729
 attempting to do some paint at one point,
 
 00:28:17.269 --> 00:28:18.832
 trying to sell hardware at another point,
 
 00:28:19.173 --> 00:28:20.974
 selling fish twine at another point.
 
 00:28:21.973 --> 00:28:24.635
 And when he dies, his estate is insolvent.
 
 00:28:25.356 --> 00:28:26.336
 And it's clear from looking
 
 00:28:26.457 --> 00:28:27.557
 at the family's letters
 
 00:28:27.877 --> 00:28:29.638
 that he and his wife are
 
 00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:31.721
 basically subsidized by his
 
 00:28:31.760 --> 00:28:33.301
 son in Nova Scotia and his
 
 00:28:33.342 --> 00:28:34.603
 son-in-law in Massachusetts.
 
 00:28:35.623 --> 00:28:37.223
 His son in Nova Scotia, Simon Bradstreet,
 
 00:28:37.243 --> 00:28:38.285
 writes to his father very
 
 00:28:38.325 --> 00:28:39.045
 clearly in the early
 
 00:28:40.125 --> 00:28:41.145
 Don't deprive yourself of
 
 00:28:41.185 --> 00:28:42.987
 life's finer things because, you know,
 
 00:28:43.027 --> 00:28:43.787
 we've got you.
 
 00:28:43.846 --> 00:28:44.727
 We can send the money that
 
 00:28:44.747 --> 00:28:45.607
 we're investing here and
 
 00:28:45.748 --> 00:28:47.367
 your son-in-law can invest in you.
 
 00:28:47.688 --> 00:28:48.627
 So, you know,
 
 00:28:48.688 --> 00:28:50.388
 he's not the example that the
 
 00:28:50.709 --> 00:28:51.909
 scholars of repatriation
 
 00:28:51.929 --> 00:28:53.430
 would like him to be of
 
 00:28:53.490 --> 00:28:54.529
 this well-connected
 
 00:28:54.569 --> 00:28:55.650
 businessman who's welcomed
 
 00:28:55.670 --> 00:28:56.691
 back because of that.
 
 00:28:57.111 --> 00:28:57.971
 He's actually quite the opposite.
 
 00:28:57.990 --> 00:28:58.830
 He's welcomed back because
 
 00:28:58.871 --> 00:29:00.211
 his daughter marries a
 
 00:29:00.271 --> 00:29:01.551
 prominent New Englander.
 
 00:29:02.011 --> 00:29:03.413
 And this is what allows him to come back.
 
 00:29:03.452 --> 00:29:05.113
 He's never the businessman he had been.
 
 00:29:05.788 --> 00:29:07.348
 interesting so a lot of this
 
 00:29:07.409 --> 00:29:08.729
 I mean you really have this
 
 00:29:08.788 --> 00:29:10.670
 wonderful family story and
 
 00:29:10.690 --> 00:29:11.670
 I wonder what kind of
 
 00:29:11.710 --> 00:29:13.371
 broader theme we can draw
 
 00:29:13.391 --> 00:29:14.330
 from this I mean are they
 
 00:29:14.431 --> 00:29:15.771
 unique are they do they
 
 00:29:15.791 --> 00:29:16.971
 bear out do they contradict
 
 00:29:17.011 --> 00:29:18.292
 other things we know about
 
 00:29:18.512 --> 00:29:20.513
 the loyalists in exile and returning
 
 00:29:21.433 --> 00:29:21.795
 So Bob,
 
 00:29:21.835 --> 00:29:22.955
 this tells me that I've definitely
 
 00:29:22.976 --> 00:29:23.836
 got to dig into this
 
 00:29:23.856 --> 00:29:25.460
 because the students in New
 
 00:29:25.480 --> 00:29:26.280
 Brunswick asked me the
 
 00:29:26.320 --> 00:29:27.362
 exact same question
 
 00:29:27.722 --> 00:29:29.144
 yesterday when I was speaking to them.
 
 00:29:29.726 --> 00:29:31.268
 So I think the Robies are
 
 00:29:31.468 --> 00:29:32.328
 unique in some ways.
 
 00:29:33.510 --> 00:29:34.211
 I think the story of
 
 00:29:34.251 --> 00:29:36.174
 repatriation is a unique one.
 
 00:29:37.415 --> 00:29:38.337
 They are definitely among
 
 00:29:38.417 --> 00:29:39.819
 the minority of Loyalists
 
 00:29:39.839 --> 00:29:41.362
 who return to Massachusetts,
 
 00:29:41.922 --> 00:29:42.824
 but I think the way that
 
 00:29:42.844 --> 00:29:44.766
 they do return is very
 
 00:29:44.806 --> 00:29:46.468
 similar to how other families return,
 
 00:29:46.508 --> 00:29:47.028
 and that is through
 
 00:29:47.068 --> 00:29:48.009
 marriage connections
 
 00:29:48.351 --> 00:29:50.073
 created by Loyalist
 
 00:29:50.173 --> 00:29:51.855
 daughters marrying Patriot sons.
 
 00:29:52.336 --> 00:29:53.277
 I think that that tends to
 
 00:29:53.297 --> 00:29:54.117
 be the commonality.
 
 00:29:54.798 --> 00:29:57.539
 I think in terms of the loyalist diaspora,
 
 00:29:57.579 --> 00:29:58.740
 though, the loyalists,
 
 00:29:58.920 --> 00:30:00.060
 the Robies are very
 
 00:30:00.121 --> 00:30:02.422
 indicative of the loyalist experience.
 
 00:30:03.001 --> 00:30:03.521
 I mean, you know,
 
 00:30:03.701 --> 00:30:05.202
 I somewhat take umbrage
 
 00:30:05.242 --> 00:30:06.323
 with a lot of loyalist
 
 00:30:06.343 --> 00:30:07.782
 scholarship that talks about, you know,
 
 00:30:07.803 --> 00:30:09.044
 the political ideologies.
 
 00:30:09.963 --> 00:30:10.144
 I mean,
 
 00:30:10.203 --> 00:30:11.285
 so many of the books written about
 
 00:30:11.325 --> 00:30:12.644
 loyalists basically ask the question,
 
 00:30:12.724 --> 00:30:13.704
 why were they loyalists?
 
 00:30:13.765 --> 00:30:14.026
 You know,
 
 00:30:14.385 --> 00:30:15.826
 what commonalities can we find
 
 00:30:15.846 --> 00:30:17.247
 amongst them in political thought?
 
 00:30:18.047 --> 00:30:18.227
 And
 
 00:30:18.717 --> 00:30:20.397
 We have to remember that that term,
 
 00:30:20.417 --> 00:30:21.940
 that moniker, loyalists,
 
 00:30:22.400 --> 00:30:23.040
 this is something that's
 
 00:30:23.080 --> 00:30:24.682
 created in the
 
 00:30:24.741 --> 00:30:26.022
 late-seventeen-eighties as
 
 00:30:26.063 --> 00:30:26.824
 they're trying to get
 
 00:30:26.884 --> 00:30:28.444
 compensation from the crown.
 
 00:30:29.246 --> 00:30:30.247
 They saw themselves as
 
 00:30:30.366 --> 00:30:31.928
 refugees during the war.
 
 00:30:32.684 --> 00:30:34.026
 And so I think what the Roby
 
 00:30:34.046 --> 00:30:35.086
 family's experience in
 
 00:30:35.207 --> 00:30:38.990
 exile shows us is how refugee status,
 
 00:30:39.009 --> 00:30:39.230
 you know,
 
 00:30:39.289 --> 00:30:42.173
 being in exile was central to
 
 00:30:42.212 --> 00:30:43.173
 the loyalist identity,
 
 00:30:43.252 --> 00:30:44.634
 more so than any commitment
 
 00:30:44.653 --> 00:30:45.795
 to king and parliament or
 
 00:30:45.835 --> 00:30:47.215
 the British Empire writ large.
 
 00:30:48.096 --> 00:30:49.337
 What they experienced was
 
 00:30:49.377 --> 00:30:50.338
 being removed from home,
 
 00:30:50.939 --> 00:30:51.859
 from having to make
 
 00:30:51.920 --> 00:30:53.381
 connections amongst a group
 
 00:30:53.421 --> 00:30:55.242
 of people who shared little in common.
 
 00:30:55.742 --> 00:30:57.484
 about longing for home,
 
 00:30:57.585 --> 00:30:59.826
 about trying to rebuild new networks.
 
 00:31:00.287 --> 00:31:01.448
 So I think that that story
 
 00:31:01.468 --> 00:31:02.989
 of the Roby families is so
 
 00:31:03.028 --> 00:31:04.190
 important when we look at
 
 00:31:04.250 --> 00:31:05.651
 the writings of other loyalists,
 
 00:31:05.750 --> 00:31:06.652
 is remember that even the
 
 00:31:06.672 --> 00:31:08.272
 times they are talking about politics,
 
 00:31:08.834 --> 00:31:10.214
 there's so much more,
 
 00:31:10.315 --> 00:31:11.596
 especially in terms of the
 
 00:31:11.635 --> 00:31:12.916
 refugee experience that is
 
 00:31:13.076 --> 00:31:14.698
 influencing their view on things.
 
 00:31:15.499 --> 00:31:17.359
 And even though the Robys will return,
 
 00:31:17.420 --> 00:31:19.061
 Thomas Roby will return, his cousin,
 
 00:31:19.102 --> 00:31:20.143
 Jonathan Sewell, never does.
 
 00:31:21.083 --> 00:31:22.403
 He remains in St.
 
 00:31:22.423 --> 00:31:23.125
 John, New Brunswick.
 
 00:31:23.484 --> 00:31:24.464
 His sons go on to be
 
 00:31:24.525 --> 00:31:26.086
 prominent members of
 
 00:31:26.145 --> 00:31:28.147
 parliament in Canada or in
 
 00:31:28.167 --> 00:31:29.989
 their respective colonies, I should say,
 
 00:31:30.249 --> 00:31:31.148
 and judges.
 
 00:31:31.650 --> 00:31:33.931
 And he writes very clearly to his cousin,
 
 00:31:34.111 --> 00:31:35.951
 basically before Thomas Robey returns,
 
 00:31:35.991 --> 00:31:36.932
 that, you know,
 
 00:31:37.012 --> 00:31:38.173
 you're going back because
 
 00:31:38.233 --> 00:31:40.414
 you can find it in you to do this.
 
 00:31:40.815 --> 00:31:42.616
 But he says something along the lines of,
 
 00:31:43.537 --> 00:31:44.557
 there's not enough space in
 
 00:31:44.577 --> 00:31:46.358
 the whole world for all of us.
 
 00:31:46.398 --> 00:31:47.720
 And I have no desire to see
 
 00:31:47.799 --> 00:31:49.121
 my former friends, including his friend,
 
 00:31:49.141 --> 00:31:49.780
 John Adams, return.
 
 00:31:49.941 --> 00:31:52.721
 who he is when he was in in New England.
 
 00:31:52.741 --> 00:31:53.981
 I'm sorry when he was in London.
 
 00:31:54.541 --> 00:31:55.603
 But I have no desire to see
 
 00:31:55.663 --> 00:31:56.803
 my former friends ever again.
 
 00:31:57.262 --> 00:31:57.803
 So, you know,
 
 00:31:57.843 --> 00:31:59.183
 there's also this dichotomy
 
 00:31:59.203 --> 00:32:00.104
 that's going on amongst the
 
 00:32:00.124 --> 00:32:01.084
 loyalists about those who
 
 00:32:01.403 --> 00:32:02.565
 who recognize that the
 
 00:32:02.585 --> 00:32:04.464
 future for them is back in the States,
 
 00:32:04.484 --> 00:32:05.826
 whereas others are saying, no, no,
 
 00:32:05.846 --> 00:32:06.306
 there's no way.
 
 00:32:08.298 --> 00:32:10.561
 And Thomas Roby hadn't
 
 00:32:10.603 --> 00:32:12.425
 really taken a strong political stand.
 
 00:32:12.445 --> 00:32:13.247
 I mean, he'd done a couple.
 
 00:32:13.267 --> 00:32:14.368
 He had been a merchant,
 
 00:32:14.409 --> 00:32:15.349
 so he violates the
 
 00:32:15.391 --> 00:32:16.432
 non-importation agreement.
 
 00:32:16.893 --> 00:32:18.075
 He signs the letter thanking
 
 00:32:18.115 --> 00:32:19.017
 Governor Hutchinson,
 
 00:32:19.037 --> 00:32:20.378
 and that's basically enough
 
 00:32:20.419 --> 00:32:21.441
 to get him booted out.
 
 00:32:22.030 --> 00:32:23.510
 Even better than that, Bob,
 
 00:32:23.750 --> 00:32:25.471
 he writes a newspaper
 
 00:32:25.592 --> 00:32:27.291
 advertisement in February
 
 00:32:27.332 --> 00:32:28.432
 of seventeen seventy five.
 
 00:32:28.853 --> 00:32:29.553
 So this is, you know,
 
 00:32:29.913 --> 00:32:31.874
 right before the fighting breaks out.
 
 00:32:32.314 --> 00:32:33.213
 He writes a newspaper
 
 00:32:33.294 --> 00:32:34.554
 advertisement in the Essex
 
 00:32:34.614 --> 00:32:37.515
 Gazette that says and again,
 
 00:32:37.555 --> 00:32:38.976
 I'm paraphrasing, but I'm getting close.
 
 00:32:39.336 --> 00:32:39.576
 He says,
 
 00:32:39.635 --> 00:32:41.655
 I never had an intention to hurt
 
 00:32:41.715 --> 00:32:43.696
 the town or country to which I belong.
 
 00:32:44.212 --> 00:32:45.394
 And if I have done so,
 
 00:32:45.693 --> 00:32:46.673
 I ask your forgiveness.
 
 00:32:46.693 --> 00:32:47.835
 I am true to his glory,
 
 00:32:47.894 --> 00:32:48.835
 I think is his line.
 
 00:32:49.234 --> 00:32:50.155
 So he's also someone who
 
 00:32:50.195 --> 00:32:50.996
 reads the writing on the
 
 00:32:51.016 --> 00:32:52.777
 wall before Lafayette and Concord.
 
 00:32:53.156 --> 00:32:54.438
 He recognizes that an armed
 
 00:32:54.458 --> 00:32:55.337
 conflict is coming.
 
 00:32:55.657 --> 00:32:56.858
 He recognizes that he's been
 
 00:32:57.219 --> 00:32:59.059
 cast on the other side of
 
 00:32:59.099 --> 00:33:00.881
 the patriot majority of Marblehead,
 
 00:33:01.181 --> 00:33:02.240
 but he doesn't necessarily
 
 00:33:02.280 --> 00:33:03.602
 see himself on that side.
 
 00:33:03.642 --> 00:33:04.682
 He believes that even in
 
 00:33:04.782 --> 00:33:06.083
 February of seventeen seventy five,
 
 00:33:06.423 --> 00:33:08.124
 he can still reconcile with
 
 00:33:08.163 --> 00:33:09.044
 the patriot majority.
 
 00:33:09.085 --> 00:33:10.144
 Interesting.
 
 00:33:10.244 --> 00:33:11.726
 And I'm thinking now of Albert Gary,
 
 00:33:11.746 --> 00:33:12.747
 who at this time is also
 
 00:33:12.807 --> 00:33:13.627
 kind of ambivalent.
 
 00:33:13.647 --> 00:33:13.887
 I mean,
 
 00:33:13.948 --> 00:33:15.809
 he had Roby involved in the
 
 00:33:15.849 --> 00:33:18.372
 smallpox hospital as well that Gary built,
 
 00:33:18.413 --> 00:33:20.074
 and then the mob destroys it.
 
 00:33:20.114 --> 00:33:21.895
 And Gary sees this as a real affront.
 
 00:33:23.176 --> 00:33:23.396
 Yes,
 
 00:33:23.457 --> 00:33:24.837
 Roby actually has his whole family
 
 00:33:24.958 --> 00:33:27.039
 inoculated against smallpox,
 
 00:33:27.441 --> 00:33:29.142
 which gets him the ire of
 
 00:33:29.182 --> 00:33:30.523
 people in Marblehead as well,
 
 00:33:30.983 --> 00:33:32.025
 puts him on their bad list.
 
 00:33:32.305 --> 00:33:33.345
 their naughty list because
 
 00:33:33.645 --> 00:33:34.405
 um they're of course
 
 00:33:34.445 --> 00:33:35.945
 opposed to this but
 
 00:33:35.987 --> 00:33:36.707
 remember that thomas
 
 00:33:36.767 --> 00:33:37.747
 robey's father had been a
 
 00:33:37.807 --> 00:33:39.268
 scientist right right and
 
 00:33:39.448 --> 00:33:40.327
 he had grown up with his
 
 00:33:40.347 --> 00:33:41.949
 father's library and so
 
 00:33:42.068 --> 00:33:43.328
 probably had a bit of an
 
 00:33:43.409 --> 00:33:44.190
 understanding about
 
 00:33:44.230 --> 00:33:45.410
 inoculation and the benefit
 
 00:33:45.430 --> 00:33:46.651
 this might provide his
 
 00:33:46.691 --> 00:33:47.990
 family especially when they
 
 00:33:48.010 --> 00:33:48.892
 go into exile right
 
 00:33:48.932 --> 00:33:50.571
 smallpox uh decimates
 
 00:33:50.892 --> 00:33:52.712
 loyalist communities um who
 
 00:33:52.752 --> 00:33:53.692
 are translating who are
 
 00:33:53.752 --> 00:33:54.894
 transferring to nova scotia
 
 00:33:55.213 --> 00:33:56.294
 And so this inoculation and
 
 00:33:56.314 --> 00:33:57.154
 smallpox will actually
 
 00:33:57.214 --> 00:33:59.395
 spare a significant number of his family,
 
 00:33:59.596 --> 00:34:01.236
 but does earn him a spot on
 
 00:34:01.256 --> 00:34:02.696
 the naughty list in Marblehead.
 
 00:34:02.737 --> 00:34:02.797
 So.
 
 00:34:02.817 --> 00:34:05.038
 Yeah, it's amazing.
 
 00:34:05.097 --> 00:34:06.898
 It's these small things, you know,
 
 00:34:06.919 --> 00:34:08.079
 we think about the big issues,
 
 00:34:08.139 --> 00:34:10.320
 but here you have inoculation or,
 
 00:34:10.340 --> 00:34:10.800
 you know,
 
 00:34:11.440 --> 00:34:13.121
 maybe personal grudges people
 
 00:34:13.161 --> 00:34:14.021
 might have had against
 
 00:34:14.521 --> 00:34:15.461
 someone like Thomas Roby
 
 00:34:15.481 --> 00:34:17.342
 that was really driving a lot of this.
 
 00:34:17.963 --> 00:34:19.943
 It's really, really fascinating stories.
 
 00:34:21.925 --> 00:34:24.925
 I'm wondering, you make a point, too, that
 
 00:34:25.318 --> 00:34:26.480
 From Massachusetts, again,
 
 00:34:26.500 --> 00:34:28.322
 we can't really use exact figures,
 
 00:34:28.342 --> 00:34:29.543
 but about fourteen percent
 
 00:34:29.603 --> 00:34:30.963
 of the exiles return.
 
 00:34:30.983 --> 00:34:31.824
 And I don't know if there's
 
 00:34:31.864 --> 00:34:33.846
 any speculation about other
 
 00:34:33.865 --> 00:34:35.668
 places that have larger diasporas,
 
 00:34:35.708 --> 00:34:37.630
 if this is a big number or
 
 00:34:37.650 --> 00:34:38.469
 a small number just
 
 00:34:38.510 --> 00:34:40.052
 compared to other places.
 
 00:34:40.972 --> 00:34:42.012
 It is really interesting
 
 00:34:42.052 --> 00:34:43.333
 when you look state by state.
 
 00:34:43.393 --> 00:34:44.914
 I think Rebecca Brannan
 
 00:34:45.074 --> 00:34:45.934
 makes a really important
 
 00:34:45.974 --> 00:34:46.875
 point for all of us to
 
 00:34:46.894 --> 00:34:48.896
 remember is that far more loyalists,
 
 00:34:48.996 --> 00:34:49.817
 if twenty percent of the
 
 00:34:49.856 --> 00:34:51.137
 population was loyalists
 
 00:34:51.338 --> 00:34:52.838
 during the revolution,
 
 00:34:52.858 --> 00:34:54.039
 so that's upwards of five
 
 00:34:54.059 --> 00:34:56.280
 hundred thousand white colonists,
 
 00:34:56.480 --> 00:34:57.860
 if upwards of twenty
 
 00:34:57.900 --> 00:34:59.362
 percent of the population is loyalists,
 
 00:34:59.681 --> 00:35:00.663
 the vast majority,
 
 00:35:00.702 --> 00:35:02.182
 if only a hundred thousand at most,
 
 00:35:02.364 --> 00:35:03.143
 are leaving the states,
 
 00:35:03.184 --> 00:35:04.804
 the vast majority are remaining.
 
 00:35:06.005 --> 00:35:07.686
 So most states have the
 
 00:35:07.726 --> 00:35:09.206
 experience of welcoming the
 
 00:35:09.226 --> 00:35:10.407
 loyalists back into their
 
 00:35:10.467 --> 00:35:11.947
 societies rather seamlessly.
 
 00:35:11.967 --> 00:35:13.007
 I mean, you know,
 
 00:35:13.068 --> 00:35:14.007
 if we compare the first
 
 00:35:14.068 --> 00:35:14.987
 American Revolution to the
 
 00:35:15.027 --> 00:35:17.208
 second one being the Civil War, you know,
 
 00:35:17.228 --> 00:35:20.409
 there is no great, you know,
 
 00:35:20.650 --> 00:35:23.590
 loyalist myth in American society today,
 
 00:35:23.630 --> 00:35:23.811
 right?
 
 00:35:23.831 --> 00:35:26.391
 There's no lost cause for the loyalists.
 
 00:35:26.751 --> 00:35:28.373
 um so in a lot of ways I
 
 00:35:28.413 --> 00:35:29.313
 think that that speaks to
 
 00:35:29.333 --> 00:35:30.695
 the fact that the american
 
 00:35:30.775 --> 00:35:31.695
 states and maybe this will
 
 00:35:31.715 --> 00:35:32.755
 be provocative but the
 
 00:35:32.775 --> 00:35:33.695
 american states that are
 
 00:35:33.755 --> 00:35:35.117
 created with especially the
 
 00:35:35.177 --> 00:35:36.697
 constitution are really
 
 00:35:36.777 --> 00:35:38.099
 very little different than
 
 00:35:38.159 --> 00:35:39.539
 uh the british empire that
 
 00:35:39.579 --> 00:35:41.641
 many loyalists were fond of
 
 00:35:42.141 --> 00:35:42.702
 so maybe the american
 
 00:35:42.722 --> 00:35:43.822
 revolution isn't that
 
 00:35:43.882 --> 00:35:45.143
 revolutionary but there's
 
 00:35:45.264 --> 00:35:47.005
 right there's no lost cause
 
 00:35:47.284 --> 00:35:48.286
 uh for the for the
 
 00:35:48.306 --> 00:35:49.166
 loyalists in any of the
 
 00:35:49.186 --> 00:35:50.586
 states like you can't find
 
 00:35:51.146 --> 00:35:52.208
 a loyalist identity in
 
 00:35:52.228 --> 00:35:53.409
 massachusetts for example
 
 00:35:53.688 --> 00:35:54.528
 We're in South Carolina.
 
 00:35:54.550 --> 00:35:55.869
 So numbers are really hard
 
 00:35:56.090 --> 00:35:58.190
 to figure out exactly how many came back.
 
 00:35:58.931 --> 00:35:59.572
 But I think what's
 
 00:35:59.612 --> 00:36:00.693
 indicative of the fact that
 
 00:36:01.152 --> 00:36:01.893
 there are a number,
 
 00:36:01.974 --> 00:36:03.373
 but we don't have any sort
 
 00:36:03.414 --> 00:36:07.817
 of cultural artifact of these people.
 
 00:36:07.856 --> 00:36:08.896
 I think it's about deference again.
 
 00:36:08.916 --> 00:36:09.958
 A lot of them recognize that
 
 00:36:09.978 --> 00:36:10.918
 they were on the wrong side.
 
 00:36:10.958 --> 00:36:12.898
 And so don't stir up trouble
 
 00:36:12.938 --> 00:36:14.300
 when they reintegrate or
 
 00:36:14.360 --> 00:36:15.581
 there's no kind of major push.
 
 00:36:16.121 --> 00:36:17.641
 In some places in eighteen twelve,
 
 00:36:17.661 --> 00:36:18.081
 of course,
 
 00:36:18.161 --> 00:36:20.563
 there is a group of late
 
 00:36:20.603 --> 00:36:21.744
 loyalists who will leave
 
 00:36:21.784 --> 00:36:23.065
 the colony or leave the states.
 
 00:36:23.465 --> 00:36:24.465
 and end up in Canada.
 
 00:36:25.485 --> 00:36:26.865
 And the Roby family suffers
 
 00:36:26.905 --> 00:36:27.606
 during the War of eighteen
 
 00:36:27.626 --> 00:36:28.547
 twelve because it cuts off
 
 00:36:28.567 --> 00:36:29.606
 a lot of their connections
 
 00:36:30.186 --> 00:36:30.967
 to Nova Scotia.
 
 00:36:31.086 --> 00:36:32.347
 So you do see some of this then.
 
 00:36:32.887 --> 00:36:34.327
 But I think that speaks to, again,
 
 00:36:34.347 --> 00:36:35.047
 the fact that there are
 
 00:36:35.268 --> 00:36:36.248
 repatriating loyalists,
 
 00:36:36.628 --> 00:36:37.849
 but there's very little of
 
 00:36:37.869 --> 00:36:39.570
 kind of this cultural artifact of them.
 
 00:36:39.650 --> 00:36:40.050
 Interesting.
 
 00:36:40.690 --> 00:36:40.789
 Now,
 
 00:36:40.809 --> 00:36:42.590
 do you think growing up in Nova Scotia
 
 00:36:42.650 --> 00:36:43.771
 has helped you look at this
 
 00:36:43.831 --> 00:36:44.931
 in a different way than, say,
 
 00:36:44.951 --> 00:36:45.590
 someone who grew up in
 
 00:36:45.630 --> 00:36:47.431
 Massachusetts doing this
 
 00:36:47.592 --> 00:36:48.492
 study would have
 
 00:36:48.572 --> 00:36:49.833
 interpreted the revolution
 
 00:36:49.893 --> 00:36:50.652
 and the loyalists?
 
 00:36:51.057 --> 00:36:53.123
 Yeah, so we grew up going to Nova Scotia,
 
 00:36:53.202 --> 00:36:53.463
 right?
 
 00:36:54.746 --> 00:36:55.588
 And to Prince Edward Island
 
 00:36:55.608 --> 00:36:56.349
 and New Brunswick.
 
 00:36:56.570 --> 00:36:58.414
 My family is from Atlantic Canada.
 
 00:36:59.072 --> 00:37:00.032
 And absolutely.
 
 00:37:00.134 --> 00:37:00.373
 I mean,
 
 00:37:00.554 --> 00:37:01.753
 it was funny talking with family
 
 00:37:01.793 --> 00:37:03.074
 members and visiting
 
 00:37:03.454 --> 00:37:05.396
 Loyalist sites as kids.
 
 00:37:05.416 --> 00:37:06.436
 You know, they were the good guys,
 
 00:37:06.836 --> 00:37:07.416
 the Loyalists.
 
 00:37:08.177 --> 00:37:09.478
 And then in the States, in the textbooks,
 
 00:37:09.557 --> 00:37:10.717
 I would read the Loyalists
 
 00:37:10.737 --> 00:37:11.418
 were the bad guys.
 
 00:37:11.438 --> 00:37:12.719
 They were the one-sided revolution.
 
 00:37:12.739 --> 00:37:13.579
 They didn't understand how
 
 00:37:13.599 --> 00:37:14.300
 things were changing.
 
 00:37:15.219 --> 00:37:15.920
 And so I think kind of
 
 00:37:15.981 --> 00:37:17.041
 marrying those two narratives,
 
 00:37:17.081 --> 00:37:17.981
 I think the Roby family
 
 00:37:18.021 --> 00:37:18.782
 shows us that there's a
 
 00:37:18.802 --> 00:37:20.342
 little bit of both of this
 
 00:37:20.382 --> 00:37:21.222
 story going on.
 
 00:37:21.523 --> 00:37:22.864
 They may not have actually
 
 00:37:22.923 --> 00:37:24.143
 understood how things were
 
 00:37:24.164 --> 00:37:24.704
 changing in the
 
 00:37:29.550 --> 00:37:30.411
 But like I think the
 
 00:37:30.451 --> 00:37:32.193
 Canadian narrative tells us
 
 00:37:32.773 --> 00:37:34.034
 is that the loyalists are
 
 00:37:34.135 --> 00:37:35.295
 far from some sort of
 
 00:37:35.456 --> 00:37:37.677
 aristocratic elite who are
 
 00:37:37.777 --> 00:37:39.199
 bent on creating, you know,
 
 00:37:39.320 --> 00:37:40.161
 a modern version of
 
 00:37:40.201 --> 00:37:43.364
 aristocracy in England, in North America.
 
 00:37:43.844 --> 00:37:45.887
 That's not what they are trying to do.
 
 00:37:46.327 --> 00:37:47.527
 And there is something here, too,
 
 00:37:47.568 --> 00:37:49.911
 about more so in Canada than the U.S.
 
 00:37:50.110 --> 00:37:51.652
 There is the loyalist myth in Canada.
 
 00:37:52.072 --> 00:37:53.574
 That becomes a very much
 
 00:37:53.594 --> 00:37:54.373
 kind of story about the
 
 00:37:54.534 --> 00:37:55.795
 Anglo founding of Canada.
 
 00:37:55.815 --> 00:37:58.315
 And that's very misleading as well, right?
 
 00:37:58.635 --> 00:37:59.777
 The loyalists do definitely
 
 00:37:59.876 --> 00:38:01.378
 not cement any sort of like
 
 00:38:01.597 --> 00:38:03.579
 Anglo Canada in the way
 
 00:38:03.599 --> 00:38:04.438
 that the loyalist myth
 
 00:38:04.478 --> 00:38:05.380
 would like to present.
 
 00:38:06.293 --> 00:38:06.853
 Very interesting.
 
 00:38:06.893 --> 00:38:07.835
 Very interesting.
 
 00:38:07.855 --> 00:38:08.574
 Shirley Green,
 
 00:38:08.614 --> 00:38:09.775
 another scholar who's been a
 
 00:38:09.835 --> 00:38:10.715
 guest with us,
 
 00:38:11.717 --> 00:38:13.277
 first got on to tracing one
 
 00:38:13.297 --> 00:38:14.498
 of her ancestors whom she
 
 00:38:14.538 --> 00:38:15.418
 knew was involved in the
 
 00:38:15.458 --> 00:38:17.239
 revolution and then tracing it.
 
 00:38:17.699 --> 00:38:18.059
 Of course,
 
 00:38:18.099 --> 00:38:19.559
 he was connected to Nova Scotia
 
 00:38:19.579 --> 00:38:20.280
 and she realized he had
 
 00:38:20.320 --> 00:38:22.081
 fought for the other side.
 
 00:38:22.181 --> 00:38:24.161
 And then he had shifted loyalties.
 
 00:38:24.181 --> 00:38:25.402
 He had fought for the American side,
 
 00:38:25.422 --> 00:38:25.943
 then shifts
 
 00:38:26.063 --> 00:38:27.884
 African-American in this period.
 
 00:38:28.527 --> 00:38:28.786
 But again,
 
 00:38:28.827 --> 00:38:30.429
 it tells us this tangled nature
 
 00:38:30.469 --> 00:38:32.831
 of this and that we can't
 
 00:38:32.871 --> 00:38:34.371
 simply look at good guys
 
 00:38:34.411 --> 00:38:35.733
 and bad guys as a way of
 
 00:38:35.773 --> 00:38:36.474
 understanding this.
 
 00:38:36.853 --> 00:38:37.114
 Right.
 
 00:38:37.215 --> 00:38:38.074
 And I think another good
 
 00:38:38.114 --> 00:38:39.235
 takeaway from that story
 
 00:38:39.295 --> 00:38:40.036
 and from looking at the
 
 00:38:40.077 --> 00:38:42.838
 Robies is that loyalties and allegiance,
 
 00:38:42.858 --> 00:38:44.041
 there's a spectrum, right?
 
 00:38:44.141 --> 00:38:45.161
 I think even labeling the
 
 00:38:45.902 --> 00:38:46.822
 Robies loyalists,
 
 00:38:46.943 --> 00:38:47.983
 I only do that because they
 
 00:38:48.043 --> 00:38:49.083
 end up in Nova Scotia with
 
 00:38:49.143 --> 00:38:49.784
 other loyalists,
 
 00:38:50.244 --> 00:38:51.144
 but they're far from these
 
 00:38:51.164 --> 00:38:52.166
 like devout defenders of
 
 00:38:52.206 --> 00:38:53.567
 empires we've been talking about.
 
 00:38:54.067 --> 00:38:55.007
 And it's also important to
 
 00:38:55.047 --> 00:38:56.007
 remember that just like
 
 00:38:56.027 --> 00:38:56.849
 there's a spectrum of
 
 00:38:56.889 --> 00:38:57.929
 loyalties that people can
 
 00:38:58.010 --> 00:38:59.130
 change back and forth,
 
 00:38:59.590 --> 00:39:01.431
 there's also like levels of loyalties.
 
 00:39:01.972 --> 00:39:03.273
 Robies had loyalties to
 
 00:39:03.293 --> 00:39:05.153
 their family and to diverse
 
 00:39:05.173 --> 00:39:06.014
 family members.
 
 00:39:06.454 --> 00:39:08.356
 And so how you marry those
 
 00:39:09.456 --> 00:39:10.518
 loyalties with your
 
 00:39:10.557 --> 00:39:11.498
 political ones is I think
 
 00:39:11.557 --> 00:39:11.998
 important as well.
 
 00:39:12.159 --> 00:39:12.798
 Interesting.
 
 00:39:15.052 --> 00:39:17.012
 We've been talking with G. Patrick O'Brien,
 
 00:39:17.032 --> 00:39:17.813
 assistant teaching
 
 00:39:17.833 --> 00:39:19.994
 professor at the University of Tampa.
 
 00:39:20.954 --> 00:39:21.313
 Notably,
 
 00:39:21.333 --> 00:39:23.295
 you chose not to go back to Nova
 
 00:39:23.315 --> 00:39:25.135
 Scotia to teach, but are in Tampa,
 
 00:39:27.114 --> 00:39:30.036
 working on a book soon to be finished,
 
 00:39:30.155 --> 00:39:31.235
 Unknown and Unlamented,
 
 00:39:31.255 --> 00:39:32.775
 The Exile and Repatriation
 
 00:39:32.795 --> 00:39:34.016
 of the Loyalist Family in
 
 00:39:34.036 --> 00:39:35.577
 the Era of the American Revolution.
 
 00:39:35.617 --> 00:39:36.376
 You've also done work with
 
 00:39:36.396 --> 00:39:37.677
 the Mass Historical Society,
 
 00:39:37.717 --> 00:39:40.157
 working on their page on loyalists,
 
 00:39:40.297 --> 00:39:41.077
 other things.
 
 00:39:41.097 --> 00:39:42.737
 So thank you so much for joining us, Pat.
 
 00:39:43.222 --> 00:39:43.443
 Yes.
 
 00:39:43.503 --> 00:39:45.043
 Thank you, Bob, for having me.
 
 00:39:45.103 --> 00:39:46.525
 It's a real pleasure to be here.
 
 00:39:46.545 --> 00:39:47.304
 Great.
 
 00:39:47.385 --> 00:39:47.744
 Thank you.
 
 00:39:48.085 --> 00:39:49.445
 And I want to thank Jonathan Lane,
 
 00:39:49.606 --> 00:39:51.306
 our producer, the man behind the curtain,
 
 00:39:51.748 --> 00:39:53.288
 and our many listeners
 
 00:39:53.327 --> 00:39:54.068
 around the country.
 
 00:39:54.088 --> 00:39:55.409
 You know, when we started out, you know,
 
 00:39:55.469 --> 00:39:57.710
 two hundred thirty some odd episodes ago,
 
 00:39:57.731 --> 00:39:58.291
 we thought we'd have a
 
 00:39:58.311 --> 00:39:59.572
 handful of folks in and around
 
 00:40:00.219 --> 00:40:01.380
 boston listening in but we
 
 00:40:01.420 --> 00:40:02.119
 actually have friends
 
 00:40:02.179 --> 00:40:03.059
 listening all around the
 
 00:40:03.079 --> 00:40:04.141
 world and every week we
 
 00:40:04.181 --> 00:40:05.300
 thank some and if you're in
 
 00:40:05.400 --> 00:40:07.081
 one of these places and
 
 00:40:07.121 --> 00:40:08.322
 want to send jonathan lane
 
 00:40:08.342 --> 00:40:09.422
 an email j lane at
 
 00:40:09.463 --> 00:40:11.063
 revolution to two fifty dot
 
 00:40:11.103 --> 00:40:12.364
 org they'll send you some
 
 00:40:12.405 --> 00:40:13.925
 of our rep two fifty gear
 
 00:40:14.365 --> 00:40:15.286
 so and if you're not in one
 
 00:40:15.326 --> 00:40:16.206
 of these places and just
 
 00:40:16.246 --> 00:40:16.867
 want to connect with
 
 00:40:16.907 --> 00:40:18.007
 jonathan j lane of
 
 00:40:18.047 --> 00:40:19.188
 revolution two fifty dot
 
 00:40:19.228 --> 00:40:20.969
 org we always love hearing from folks so
 
 00:40:21.449 --> 00:40:21.789
 This week,
 
 00:40:21.809 --> 00:40:22.690
 I want to thank folks in
 
 00:40:22.730 --> 00:40:26.351
 Philadelphia and in Schenectady, Brisbane,
 
 00:40:26.391 --> 00:40:29.072
 Australia, Skokie, Illinois, Milwaukee,
 
 00:40:29.273 --> 00:40:30.032
 Wisconsin,
 
 00:40:30.833 --> 00:40:32.054
 here in the Bay State on the
 
 00:40:32.134 --> 00:40:33.094
 island of Nantucket,
 
 00:40:33.695 --> 00:40:35.175
 and the Petite Rivière
 
 00:40:35.215 --> 00:40:36.876
 Saint-Francois in Quebec,
 
 00:40:37.797 --> 00:40:39.797
 and in Jerusalem, Amman,
 
 00:40:40.038 --> 00:40:42.159
 and Hertfordshire in Hertford.
 
 00:40:42.199 --> 00:40:43.219
 Thank you all for listening,
 
 00:40:43.259 --> 00:40:44.619
 all places between and beyond,
 
 00:40:44.639 --> 00:40:45.539
 and now we will be piped
 
 00:40:45.599 --> 00:40:46.641
 out on the road to Boston.