"Traitor's Homecoming: Benedict Arnold's Raid on New London" with Matthew Reardon

Few things shocked American patriots as the betrayal of General Benedict Arnold.  After attempting to surrender West Point to the British, Arnold led a series of raids, first in Virginia, and then in his native state of Connecticut.  Matthew E. Reardon has written a new account of Arnold's raid on New London and attack on Fort Griswold,  The Traitor's Homecoming; Benedict Arnold's Raid on New London September 4-13,  1781.

Transcript

WEBVTT
 
 00:00:00.697 --> 00:00:01.497
 Hello, everyone.
 
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 Welcome to the Revolution
 
 00:00:02.758 --> 00:00:03.878
 Two Fifty podcast.
 
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 I am Bob Allison.
 
 00:00:04.838 --> 00:00:06.839
 I chair the Rev Two Fifty Advisory Group.
 
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 We are a consortium of about
 
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 seventy five groups in
 
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 Massachusetts planning
 
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 commemorations of American independence.
 
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 And our guests today are
 
 00:00:14.641 --> 00:00:15.682
 actually going south of the
 
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 Massachusetts border to Connecticut.
 
 00:00:17.882 --> 00:00:19.443
 Our guest is Matthew Riordan,
 
 00:00:19.483 --> 00:00:20.783
 who is the author of
 
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 The Trader's Homecoming,
 
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 Benedict Arnold's Raid on New London,
 
 00:00:24.846 --> 00:00:26.306
 September fourth through thirteen,
 
 00:00:26.347 --> 00:00:28.588
 seventeen eighty one, came out last year.
 
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 Very good book.
 
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 And Matt Reardon is also a
 
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 man of many talents,
 
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 frequent contributor to the
 
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 Journal of the American Revolution,
 
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 and is now the command
 
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 historian for the
 
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 Connecticut Military
 
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 Department and a captain in
 
 00:00:42.113 --> 00:00:44.075
 Connecticut's state guard.
 
 00:00:44.354 --> 00:00:44.914
 So thank you.
 
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 Thank you so much for joining us, Matthew.
 
 00:00:46.155 --> 00:00:47.517
 Thank you for having me.
 
 00:00:49.042 --> 00:00:50.283
 So what got you, I mean,
 
 00:00:50.323 --> 00:00:51.484
 it's a great story about
 
 00:00:51.503 --> 00:00:53.704
 Benedict Arnold's raid on New London,
 
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 and you actually explored a
 
 00:00:55.506 --> 00:00:56.767
 lot of the myths about it.
 
 00:00:56.807 --> 00:00:58.847
 What drew you to the story?
 
 00:00:59.048 --> 00:00:59.207
 Well,
 
 00:00:59.247 --> 00:01:00.768
 originally it was supposed to be my
 
 00:01:00.808 --> 00:01:01.689
 master's project.
 
 00:01:01.770 --> 00:01:02.670
 I was getting my master's of
 
 00:01:02.750 --> 00:01:04.391
 education from Sacred Heart University,
 
 00:01:04.492 --> 00:01:06.513
 and we had to do getting my
 
 00:01:06.813 --> 00:01:08.073
 certification in social studies.
 
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 And we had to do something
 
 00:01:09.814 --> 00:01:10.816
 social studies related that
 
 00:01:10.835 --> 00:01:11.775
 would help in the classroom.
 
 00:01:11.816 --> 00:01:13.697
 And what I came up with was,
 
 00:01:14.278 --> 00:01:14.977
 since there was not really
 
 00:01:14.998 --> 00:01:16.399
 a lot of interpretation at the time,
 
 00:01:16.909 --> 00:01:17.968
 for Fort Griswold was an
 
 00:01:18.009 --> 00:01:18.890
 interpretation guide or
 
 00:01:18.909 --> 00:01:20.469
 field trip guide to the battlefield.
 
 00:01:20.530 --> 00:01:22.131
 So teachers could use it as a classroom.
 
 00:01:22.150 --> 00:01:25.230
 I've always been interested
 
 00:01:25.251 --> 00:01:26.432
 in battlefield interpretation,
 
 00:01:26.451 --> 00:01:27.731
 so I thought I'd take my crack at it.
 
 00:01:28.451 --> 00:01:29.873
 And so I did the project.
 
 00:01:29.912 --> 00:01:31.192
 And as I started to do research,
 
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 I started coming across all
 
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 the stories and obviously
 
 00:01:35.174 --> 00:01:35.974
 wanted to double check a
 
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 lot of the stories,
 
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 wanted to make sure that
 
 00:01:37.314 --> 00:01:38.995
 they were right and try to add my own,
 
 00:01:39.016 --> 00:01:40.275
 you know,
 
 00:01:40.316 --> 00:01:41.615
 kind of add something new to it
 
 00:01:41.635 --> 00:01:42.376
 because it's the same
 
 00:01:42.397 --> 00:01:43.537
 stories over and over again.
 
 00:01:43.557 --> 00:01:43.617
 And
 
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 When I started doing the research,
 
 00:01:45.965 --> 00:01:46.686
 I started finding a lot
 
 00:01:46.725 --> 00:01:47.706
 more than I bargained for.
 
 00:01:47.727 --> 00:01:50.790
 I have a tendency to go down
 
 00:01:50.810 --> 00:01:51.990
 a lot of rabbit holes and
 
 00:01:52.132 --> 00:01:53.492
 check places that you may
 
 00:01:53.513 --> 00:01:54.274
 not find things.
 
 00:01:54.334 --> 00:01:56.176
 And the pension records were
 
 00:01:56.355 --> 00:01:57.518
 becoming digitized.
 
 00:01:57.918 --> 00:01:58.539
 So we checked those.
 
 00:01:58.558 --> 00:01:59.379
 We had a whole bunch of new
 
 00:01:59.400 --> 00:02:00.721
 stuff on there.
 
 00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:01.701
 British newspapers.
 
 00:02:02.742 --> 00:02:03.403
 No one had looked at the
 
 00:02:03.423 --> 00:02:04.703
 British newspapers before
 
 00:02:04.802 --> 00:02:05.763
 and those were digitized.
 
 00:02:05.804 --> 00:02:06.724
 So I was like, oh my gosh,
 
 00:02:06.743 --> 00:02:07.623
 there's actually three or
 
 00:02:07.664 --> 00:02:08.723
 four letters from British
 
 00:02:08.883 --> 00:02:10.764
 officers at Fort Griswold
 
 00:02:11.224 --> 00:02:13.205
 that are telling me more details.
 
 00:02:13.224 --> 00:02:15.366
 I'm like, holy cow, this is more bigger.
 
 00:02:15.385 --> 00:02:17.526
 And my friend Don Haggis was
 
 00:02:17.566 --> 00:02:18.205
 helping me during the
 
 00:02:18.246 --> 00:02:19.045
 process and he was
 
 00:02:19.086 --> 00:02:19.806
 providing me some of the
 
 00:02:19.826 --> 00:02:21.007
 British records as far as
 
 00:02:21.046 --> 00:02:22.986
 like the regimental returns
 
 00:02:23.026 --> 00:02:23.826
 and things like that.
 
 00:02:24.427 --> 00:02:25.008
 And he's like, man,
 
 00:02:25.027 --> 00:02:25.828
 you need to make this into
 
 00:02:25.848 --> 00:02:26.328
 something bigger.
 
 00:02:26.367 --> 00:02:28.108
 This is not, I think,
 
 00:02:28.127 --> 00:02:29.149
 what it originally started to be.
 
 00:02:29.449 --> 00:02:30.128
 So actually I have it.
 
 00:02:30.149 --> 00:02:31.049
 This is where it started.
 
 00:02:32.169 --> 00:02:33.129
 The original one right here.
 
 00:02:33.729 --> 00:02:35.251
 It's full of mistakes in it.
 
 00:02:35.531 --> 00:02:36.491
 Don't really want to talk about it.
 
 00:02:36.532 --> 00:02:38.092
 And obviously you come to this.
 
 00:02:38.111 --> 00:02:39.612
 That's good.
 
 00:02:39.652 --> 00:02:40.593
 Well, congratulations.
 
 00:02:40.913 --> 00:02:42.194
 Thank you.
 
 00:02:42.215 --> 00:02:43.975
 So why was New London an
 
 00:02:44.015 --> 00:02:45.075
 objective for the British?
 
 00:02:45.415 --> 00:02:45.917
 What's happening?
 
 00:02:45.937 --> 00:02:47.537
 New London was the center of
 
 00:02:48.358 --> 00:02:50.058
 Connecticut's naval wartime effort.
 
 00:02:50.139 --> 00:02:52.199
 I mean, besides being a pretty commercial,
 
 00:02:52.259 --> 00:02:54.760
 prosperous port before the war,
 
 00:02:55.222 --> 00:02:57.122
 it became the center of all of its,
 
 00:02:57.163 --> 00:02:59.783
 let's say, naval activities during war.
 
 00:03:00.663 --> 00:03:01.925
 the Revolutionary War as far
 
 00:03:01.945 --> 00:03:04.372
 as the privateers, merchant vessels,
 
 00:03:05.495 --> 00:03:06.516
 things like that.
 
 00:03:06.877 --> 00:03:09.504
 And yes, that's it.
 
 00:03:10.907 --> 00:03:13.990
 And so why September, I mean, we know,
 
 00:03:14.090 --> 00:03:15.270
 I mean, the big story, of course,
 
 00:03:15.290 --> 00:03:16.671
 then is Yorktown.
 
 00:03:16.692 --> 00:03:18.693
 So what's happening in this
 
 00:03:18.813 --> 00:03:20.694
 area that makes Clinton
 
 00:03:20.715 --> 00:03:21.596
 send this expedition?
 
 00:03:22.056 --> 00:03:23.356
 Yeah, this is the fourth,
 
 00:03:23.477 --> 00:03:24.478
 I believe it's the fourth
 
 00:03:24.518 --> 00:03:25.418
 time the British have
 
 00:03:25.457 --> 00:03:27.158
 planned to attack New London.
 
 00:03:27.218 --> 00:03:29.040
 They've had attempts in, I think,
 
 00:03:29.100 --> 00:03:30.822
 seventeen seventy seven,
 
 00:03:30.921 --> 00:03:31.883
 seventeen seventy eight.
 
 00:03:31.983 --> 00:03:35.824
 I'm sorry, seventy eight, seventy nine.
 
 00:03:36.705 --> 00:03:37.866
 And then they want to try an eighty.
 
 00:03:37.887 --> 00:03:39.348
 But this will be the fourth attempt.
 
 00:03:40.131 --> 00:03:42.111
 And basically what has happened,
 
 00:03:42.132 --> 00:03:42.973
 George Washington wants to
 
 00:03:42.992 --> 00:03:44.073
 go south to Yorktown,
 
 00:03:44.592 --> 00:03:45.394
 but he can't let the
 
 00:03:45.413 --> 00:03:46.294
 British in New York City
 
 00:03:46.373 --> 00:03:47.474
 know that he's doing that.
 
 00:03:48.134 --> 00:03:50.175
 So he feigns an attack on New York City.
 
 00:03:51.317 --> 00:03:51.956
 Sir Henry Clinton,
 
 00:03:51.977 --> 00:03:53.057
 who's in charge of New York,
 
 00:03:53.298 --> 00:03:54.717
 falls for the deception, hook, line,
 
 00:03:54.758 --> 00:03:55.218
 and sinker,
 
 00:03:56.118 --> 00:03:59.161
 thinks that the city is about
 
 00:03:59.181 --> 00:04:00.161
 to be attacked and tries
 
 00:04:00.221 --> 00:04:01.361
 something he tried to do in
 
 00:04:01.401 --> 00:04:02.442
 seventeen seventy nine,
 
 00:04:02.923 --> 00:04:03.723
 which was to draw
 
 00:04:03.782 --> 00:04:05.223
 Washington away from an
 
 00:04:05.243 --> 00:04:06.084
 attack on the city by
 
 00:04:06.123 --> 00:04:07.544
 attacking the coastline of Connecticut.
 
 00:04:08.842 --> 00:04:10.663
 So it's a pretty interesting, you know,
 
 00:04:12.025 --> 00:04:13.806
 it's kind of weird how Sir
 
 00:04:13.847 --> 00:04:15.187
 Henry Clinton never
 
 00:04:15.228 --> 00:04:16.548
 admitted he fell for it,
 
 00:04:16.569 --> 00:04:17.629
 which I think has led a lot
 
 00:04:17.670 --> 00:04:18.750
 of other historians to not
 
 00:04:18.831 --> 00:04:19.630
 kind of see the connection
 
 00:04:19.651 --> 00:04:20.072
 between the two.
 
 00:04:20.091 --> 00:04:22.112
 Right, right.
 
 00:04:22.153 --> 00:04:23.494
 So how does Benedict Arnold
 
 00:04:23.514 --> 00:04:25.396
 get involved in this?
 
 00:04:25.415 --> 00:04:27.057
 Benedict Arnold is itching for action.
 
 00:04:27.117 --> 00:04:28.177
 He's back in New York City
 
 00:04:28.278 --> 00:04:29.658
 after participating in some
 
 00:04:29.699 --> 00:04:30.899
 raiding down in Virginia.
 
 00:04:31.639 --> 00:04:33.601
 He wants to attack Washington.
 
 00:04:33.622 --> 00:04:34.581
 He wants to attack the
 
 00:04:34.601 --> 00:04:35.822
 French before they're able
 
 00:04:35.862 --> 00:04:36.543
 to do anything.
 
 00:04:37.170 --> 00:04:38.992
 He's please fall on deaf ears.
 
 00:04:39.012 --> 00:04:40.293
 He's proposing all sorts of
 
 00:04:40.312 --> 00:04:41.533
 crazy attacks up and down
 
 00:04:41.593 --> 00:04:42.593
 New England coastline.
 
 00:04:43.675 --> 00:04:44.415
 And then, um,
 
 00:04:45.461 --> 00:04:46.521
 As Sir Henry Clinton,
 
 00:04:46.982 --> 00:04:48.081
 he actually wants to attack
 
 00:04:48.302 --> 00:04:49.281
 Rhode Island at the time, too.
 
 00:04:49.302 --> 00:04:51.483
 He wants to go after Rhode Island.
 
 00:04:51.802 --> 00:04:52.824
 When the Rhode Island attack
 
 00:04:53.324 --> 00:04:54.163
 fails because the French
 
 00:04:54.223 --> 00:04:56.024
 Navy has slipped away from him,
 
 00:04:56.564 --> 00:04:57.485
 he looks to Connecticut.
 
 00:04:57.745 --> 00:04:59.326
 And what better person to
 
 00:04:59.406 --> 00:05:01.247
 send to Connecticut is a
 
 00:05:01.567 --> 00:05:02.848
 native son of the state who
 
 00:05:02.887 --> 00:05:03.887
 knows the state arguably
 
 00:05:03.968 --> 00:05:05.267
 better than any other British general,
 
 00:05:06.168 --> 00:05:09.730
 and he lets him go on the expedition.
 
 00:05:09.750 --> 00:05:09.870
 Now,
 
 00:05:09.910 --> 00:05:11.451
 is it particularly because it's Arnold
 
 00:05:11.630 --> 00:05:13.490
 that it has such resonance in Connecticut,
 
 00:05:13.752 --> 00:05:14.351
 this raid?
 
 00:05:15.105 --> 00:05:15.485
 I think so.
 
 00:05:15.545 --> 00:05:16.786
 I've often talked to friends
 
 00:05:16.826 --> 00:05:17.307
 and things like that.
 
 00:05:17.346 --> 00:05:17.987
 I think if it was a
 
 00:05:18.028 --> 00:05:19.007
 different British general,
 
 00:05:19.608 --> 00:05:20.168
 I think we would have
 
 00:05:20.189 --> 00:05:20.908
 remembered the story a
 
 00:05:20.930 --> 00:05:21.589
 little bit differently.
 
 00:05:21.610 --> 00:05:22.589
 It's kind of got that Arnold,
 
 00:05:22.610 --> 00:05:24.031
 what do you want to call it,
 
 00:05:24.050 --> 00:05:26.773
 like a tinge to it, like a taste to it,
 
 00:05:26.793 --> 00:05:27.552
 something of that nature.
 
 00:05:28.774 --> 00:05:30.595
 Because he's never referred
 
 00:05:30.615 --> 00:05:32.196
 to as the British general Arnold.
 
 00:05:32.216 --> 00:05:33.836
 It's always like that traitor Arnold.
 
 00:05:35.517 --> 00:05:38.180
 He talked about the dog and fiend of hell.
 
 00:05:38.720 --> 00:05:40.440
 They call him in a satanic
 
 00:05:40.521 --> 00:05:41.581
 expedition into Connecticut.
 
 00:05:41.601 --> 00:05:43.182
 And he's got all this like, oh my gosh,
 
 00:05:43.223 --> 00:05:43.543
 it's like...
 
 00:05:45.165 --> 00:05:46.646
 We're not showing any bias, right?
 
 00:05:47.245 --> 00:05:47.906
 No, no.
 
 00:05:48.026 --> 00:05:49.187
 But yeah.
 
 00:05:49.206 --> 00:05:51.507
 And so I do wonder, I mean,
 
 00:05:51.689 --> 00:05:54.230
 is it you make a point that
 
 00:05:54.629 --> 00:05:56.211
 the governor and the state
 
 00:05:56.230 --> 00:05:57.291
 seems really ill prepared
 
 00:05:57.312 --> 00:05:58.952
 for this attack based on
 
 00:05:58.973 --> 00:05:59.673
 what you've written?
 
 00:06:00.850 --> 00:06:03.512
 Yeah, they've had so many false alarms.
 
 00:06:03.533 --> 00:06:04.894
 I remember I found one
 
 00:06:04.934 --> 00:06:06.134
 pension application from a
 
 00:06:06.295 --> 00:06:07.935
 militia guy from Stonington, Connecticut,
 
 00:06:07.956 --> 00:06:09.057
 which is nearby New London,
 
 00:06:09.538 --> 00:06:10.697
 who meticulously mentions
 
 00:06:10.817 --> 00:06:12.819
 every single time they've
 
 00:06:12.839 --> 00:06:14.261
 been called to New London to defend it.
 
 00:06:14.300 --> 00:06:16.223
 It's like, I mean, we're talking like,
 
 00:06:16.343 --> 00:06:16.702
 fifty,
 
 00:06:16.783 --> 00:06:18.543
 sixty times over the course of the year.
 
 00:06:18.985 --> 00:06:20.466
 Every time is a false alarm.
 
 00:06:20.886 --> 00:06:21.947
 They're not ready for it.
 
 00:06:22.639 --> 00:06:24.300
 They can't even man the
 
 00:06:24.339 --> 00:06:25.221
 defenses in New London.
 
 00:06:25.240 --> 00:06:26.221
 They're suffering throughout
 
 00:06:26.261 --> 00:06:27.182
 the entire war from
 
 00:06:27.781 --> 00:06:28.502
 recruitment of the
 
 00:06:28.622 --> 00:06:30.004
 companies that garrison the forts.
 
 00:06:31.144 --> 00:06:33.987
 And so, yeah, they're not ready for it.
 
 00:06:36.637 --> 00:06:37.617
 did fort griswold have a
 
 00:06:37.677 --> 00:06:39.677
 regular garrison it did it
 
 00:06:39.697 --> 00:06:41.178
 had um there are two
 
 00:06:41.858 --> 00:06:42.639
 regularly stationed
 
 00:06:42.680 --> 00:06:44.560
 artillery companies um
 
 00:06:44.600 --> 00:06:45.581
 there's actually there's
 
 00:06:45.641 --> 00:06:47.141
 three there's one one in
 
 00:06:47.182 --> 00:06:48.483
 stonington which is to the
 
 00:06:48.583 --> 00:06:49.603
 east of new london which is
 
 00:06:49.663 --> 00:06:50.764
 part of the same department
 
 00:06:50.783 --> 00:06:51.745
 kind of same command
 
 00:06:51.764 --> 00:06:53.204
 structure uh there's an
 
 00:06:53.245 --> 00:06:54.646
 artillery company of about
 
 00:06:54.665 --> 00:06:56.646
 I think if I off top my
 
 00:06:56.687 --> 00:06:59.668
 head about guys at fort griswold um
 
 00:07:00.228 --> 00:07:01.329
 I think the average age was
 
 00:07:01.350 --> 00:07:03.252
 about eighteen or nineteen years old.
 
 00:07:03.891 --> 00:07:05.192
 I mean, these are young, thirteen,
 
 00:07:05.233 --> 00:07:05.973
 fourteen year olds.
 
 00:07:06.014 --> 00:07:07.033
 They are so desperate.
 
 00:07:07.053 --> 00:07:07.995
 They'll put anybody in there.
 
 00:07:09.136 --> 00:07:09.937
 And over the river,
 
 00:07:10.036 --> 00:07:11.278
 across the river in New London,
 
 00:07:11.317 --> 00:07:12.218
 you have Fort Trumbull,
 
 00:07:12.237 --> 00:07:13.459
 you have another company
 
 00:07:13.918 --> 00:07:15.940
 which was about two dozen.
 
 00:07:16.781 --> 00:07:18.523
 And about a week prior to the attack,
 
 00:07:19.305 --> 00:07:20.627
 ledger, the garrison commander,
 
 00:07:20.726 --> 00:07:21.767
 actually requested from
 
 00:07:21.807 --> 00:07:23.249
 Governor Trumbull that if
 
 00:07:23.269 --> 00:07:24.548
 he can pull some guys out
 
 00:07:24.608 --> 00:07:25.689
 of the Saybrook Fort,
 
 00:07:25.829 --> 00:07:26.870
 which is an old Saybrook,
 
 00:07:27.451 --> 00:07:28.791
 and pull those guys to Fort
 
 00:07:28.831 --> 00:07:31.314
 Trumbull because Fort Trumbull was,
 
 00:07:31.353 --> 00:07:34.836
 you know, so half the militia from,
 
 00:07:34.896 --> 00:07:36.396
 actually from Old Saybrook or Saybrook.
 
 00:07:37.098 --> 00:07:38.458
 Wow.
 
 00:07:38.497 --> 00:07:39.639
 So it is militia troops who
 
 00:07:39.718 --> 00:07:41.160
 are here manning this.
 
 00:07:41.180 --> 00:07:42.021
 They're militia, yeah,
 
 00:07:42.040 --> 00:07:43.802
 they're militia trained or
 
 00:07:43.901 --> 00:07:45.343
 supposedly trained to be artillerists.
 
 00:07:46.161 --> 00:07:47.083
 Right, yeah.
 
 00:07:47.103 --> 00:07:49.244
 And what kind of, I mean, I read earlier,
 
 00:07:49.343 --> 00:07:50.524
 you wrote an article about
 
 00:07:50.545 --> 00:07:51.404
 Lieutenant Harris,
 
 00:07:51.444 --> 00:07:54.307
 who's the guy in charge who
 
 00:07:54.346 --> 00:07:56.947
 really is disastrous as a commander.
 
 00:07:57.728 --> 00:07:58.588
 Oh, Colonel Harris.
 
 00:07:58.629 --> 00:07:59.670
 Yeah, Lieutenant Colonel Harris.
 
 00:07:59.810 --> 00:08:02.571
 He is, so the New London Militia is,
 
 00:08:02.951 --> 00:08:04.271
 and also neighboring Lyme,
 
 00:08:04.351 --> 00:08:05.372
 is the third regiment of
 
 00:08:05.432 --> 00:08:06.192
 Connecticut Militia.
 
 00:08:06.754 --> 00:08:07.754
 The second in command is
 
 00:08:07.793 --> 00:08:09.314
 Lieutenant Colonel Joseph Harris.
 
 00:08:10.295 --> 00:08:11.136
 The colonel is actually
 
 00:08:11.175 --> 00:08:12.257
 Colonel Jonathan Latimer,
 
 00:08:12.276 --> 00:08:13.497
 who's of Saratoga fame.
 
 00:08:14.117 --> 00:08:14.257
 Mm-hmm.
 
 00:08:15.887 --> 00:08:16.028
 Yeah.
 
 00:08:16.048 --> 00:08:18.776
 So Harris is never seen combat before.
 
 00:08:18.815 --> 00:08:20.399
 He's never led troops before.
 
 00:08:20.880 --> 00:08:22.204
 He is woefully unprepared
 
 00:08:22.225 --> 00:08:23.528
 for everything he's about to incur.
 
 00:08:25.350 --> 00:08:26.312
 And he doesn't even follow.
 
 00:08:26.372 --> 00:08:27.312
 Lettard visits him in the
 
 00:08:27.353 --> 00:08:28.512
 morning to give him his orders,
 
 00:08:28.574 --> 00:08:30.754
 and Lettard says, you know, man the forts,
 
 00:08:30.915 --> 00:08:32.296
 which is Fort Nonsense on
 
 00:08:32.355 --> 00:08:33.817
 Town Hill in New London and
 
 00:08:33.856 --> 00:08:34.398
 Fort Trumbull.
 
 00:08:34.538 --> 00:08:35.938
 And what does Harris do?
 
 00:08:35.958 --> 00:08:36.818
 He sends the troops to the
 
 00:08:36.859 --> 00:08:38.019
 beach to meet the British at the beach.
 
 00:08:38.039 --> 00:08:39.221
 They're not even in the right place.
 
 00:08:39.760 --> 00:08:40.581
 And as soon as the shots
 
 00:08:40.601 --> 00:08:41.863
 start flying and the naval
 
 00:08:41.883 --> 00:08:43.984
 bombardment happens, militia fleeing,
 
 00:08:44.063 --> 00:08:45.926
 Harris literally freaks out.
 
 00:08:45.946 --> 00:08:46.666
 There's accounts of him
 
 00:08:46.785 --> 00:08:47.586
 suffering from a headache
 
 00:08:47.626 --> 00:08:48.326
 and running away,
 
 00:08:48.466 --> 00:08:50.509
 and it's just one mistake
 
 00:08:50.589 --> 00:08:51.870
 after another with him.
 
 00:08:52.509 --> 00:08:54.511
 He never, ever wanted to acknowledge –
 
 00:08:55.011 --> 00:08:56.231
 He wrote a very interesting
 
 00:08:56.272 --> 00:08:57.013
 piece for the local
 
 00:08:57.052 --> 00:08:57.972
 newspaper after he was
 
 00:08:58.013 --> 00:08:59.432
 court martial trying to
 
 00:08:59.472 --> 00:09:00.594
 explain his actions.
 
 00:09:00.653 --> 00:09:02.653
 But even I wasn't buying
 
 00:09:02.714 --> 00:09:04.835
 half of what he was trying to say.
 
 00:09:04.875 --> 00:09:05.894
 What does he do after the war?
 
 00:09:05.914 --> 00:09:06.775
 I mean, what kind of a career?
 
 00:09:06.816 --> 00:09:07.395
 He's a lawyer.
 
 00:09:08.556 --> 00:09:09.336
 And he's cashiered.
 
 00:09:09.355 --> 00:09:10.437
 He's dismissed from the militia.
 
 00:09:10.517 --> 00:09:11.756
 They're careful toward it.
 
 00:09:11.797 --> 00:09:13.298
 He's a very high political.
 
 00:09:13.498 --> 00:09:13.677
 You know,
 
 00:09:13.697 --> 00:09:15.878
 he's politically connected from
 
 00:09:15.937 --> 00:09:16.457
 one of the founding
 
 00:09:16.477 --> 00:09:17.278
 families in New London.
 
 00:09:17.318 --> 00:09:17.599
 He he.
 
 00:09:18.458 --> 00:09:20.679
 Basically, just please leave the militia.
 
 00:09:21.321 --> 00:09:22.201
 Go back to your career.
 
 00:09:22.221 --> 00:09:23.042
 You're not a loyalist.
 
 00:09:23.081 --> 00:09:24.241
 You're just, you know,
 
 00:09:24.261 --> 00:09:25.322
 the nicest way to say that.
 
 00:09:25.482 --> 00:09:25.883
 Yeah.
 
 00:09:25.903 --> 00:09:26.563
 He dies, I think,
 
 00:09:26.604 --> 00:09:27.764
 in seventeen ninety eight.
 
 00:09:29.304 --> 00:09:29.424
 OK.
 
 00:09:29.465 --> 00:09:30.625
 We're talking with Matt Riordan,
 
 00:09:30.806 --> 00:09:32.486
 author of Traders Homecoming,
 
 00:09:32.527 --> 00:09:33.748
 Benedict Arnold's Raid on
 
 00:09:33.788 --> 00:09:35.889
 New London set in September
 
 00:09:35.908 --> 00:09:36.909
 of seventeen eighty one.
 
 00:09:37.389 --> 00:09:38.490
 came out last year.
 
 00:09:39.051 --> 00:09:41.091
 And so you said you started
 
 00:09:41.131 --> 00:09:42.552
 this off as a way of
 
 00:09:43.033 --> 00:09:44.133
 figuring out interpretation
 
 00:09:44.173 --> 00:09:45.033
 of Fort Griswold.
 
 00:09:45.133 --> 00:09:46.874
 So can you tell us a bit
 
 00:09:46.913 --> 00:09:48.134
 more about Fort Griswold
 
 00:09:48.195 --> 00:09:50.936
 and what you've learned to use there?
 
 00:09:50.956 --> 00:09:53.517
 Fort Griswold is actually,
 
 00:09:54.017 --> 00:09:55.398
 if there was no battle there at all,
 
 00:09:55.437 --> 00:09:56.418
 it still exists today.
 
 00:09:56.658 --> 00:09:57.639
 It's an urban fort.
 
 00:09:58.178 --> 00:09:59.259
 It's in Groton, Connecticut.
 
 00:09:59.320 --> 00:10:01.541
 It sits on the banks of the Thames River.
 
 00:10:02.341 --> 00:10:03.562
 It's not a very large fort.
 
 00:10:04.341 --> 00:10:05.241
 It's about fifty yards
 
 00:10:05.261 --> 00:10:06.383
 across on all sides.
 
 00:10:07.239 --> 00:10:08.640
 It consists of a main earthen fort,
 
 00:10:08.740 --> 00:10:10.322
 which is the one I just alluded to,
 
 00:10:10.422 --> 00:10:11.663
 and also a river battery,
 
 00:10:11.683 --> 00:10:13.225
 which was constructed in...
 
 00:10:13.245 --> 00:10:14.485
 This is the second one that was there,
 
 00:10:14.505 --> 00:10:15.746
 so during the Civil War period.
 
 00:10:18.450 --> 00:10:19.831
 Yeah, so I'm sorry, I lost...
 
 00:10:20.754 --> 00:10:21.634
 So you're talking about Fort
 
 00:10:21.653 --> 00:10:23.254
 Griswold and what it looks like.
 
 00:10:23.274 --> 00:10:26.937
 So do they do interpretations?
 
 00:10:26.996 --> 00:10:27.897
 Are there other things that
 
 00:10:27.937 --> 00:10:29.378
 happen there now that people can see?
 
 00:10:29.817 --> 00:10:30.758
 It's a state park now.
 
 00:10:30.778 --> 00:10:31.658
 You can actually visit it.
 
 00:10:31.698 --> 00:10:33.038
 Like I said,
 
 00:10:33.058 --> 00:10:34.099
 there wasn't even a battle there.
 
 00:10:34.179 --> 00:10:34.700
 The fact that a
 
 00:10:34.740 --> 00:10:35.740
 Revolutionary War urban
 
 00:10:35.759 --> 00:10:36.900
 fort still exists and most
 
 00:10:36.941 --> 00:10:39.761
 of its former glory is still there.
 
 00:10:39.841 --> 00:10:41.442
 It had like fifteen foot high walls.
 
 00:10:41.461 --> 00:10:42.623
 It had ditches around it,
 
 00:10:43.102 --> 00:10:45.183
 RBT and all sorts of things.
 
 00:10:45.244 --> 00:10:47.485
 It was about thirty cannon.
 
 00:10:48.302 --> 00:10:49.383
 and the covered way too the
 
 00:10:49.423 --> 00:10:50.464
 cover way is still there
 
 00:10:51.144 --> 00:10:51.945
 which actually is the
 
 00:10:51.965 --> 00:10:54.384
 covered way cover way is it
 
 00:10:54.446 --> 00:10:55.525
 leads out what's called the
 
 00:10:55.605 --> 00:10:56.666
 sally port which is the
 
 00:10:56.706 --> 00:10:57.726
 back door of the fort we'll
 
 00:10:57.746 --> 00:10:59.126
 call it it goes down to the
 
 00:10:59.167 --> 00:11:01.087
 river battery oh wow okay
 
 00:11:01.148 --> 00:11:03.589
 interesting um and you know
 
 00:11:03.609 --> 00:11:04.470
 as you mentioned these
 
 00:11:04.690 --> 00:11:06.330
 earlier raids or attempted
 
 00:11:06.409 --> 00:11:08.311
 raids in connecticut and uh
 
 00:11:08.370 --> 00:11:10.412
 jonathan has reminded us that the british
 
 00:11:10.952 --> 00:11:13.875
 didn't where they're going
 
 00:11:13.916 --> 00:11:14.995
 to attack New London,
 
 00:11:15.697 --> 00:11:16.216
 but thought the
 
 00:11:16.256 --> 00:11:17.839
 Connecticut's militia was too prepared.
 
 00:11:17.859 --> 00:11:19.360
 This is in seventeen seventy eight.
 
 00:11:19.399 --> 00:11:20.480
 So had something changed
 
 00:11:20.600 --> 00:11:21.682
 between seventeen seventy
 
 00:11:21.761 --> 00:11:22.623
 eight and seventeen eighty
 
 00:11:22.702 --> 00:11:23.884
 one to make them.
 
 00:11:23.943 --> 00:11:25.605
 Well, during seventeen seventy eight,
 
 00:11:26.005 --> 00:11:27.106
 the British are involved in
 
 00:11:27.126 --> 00:11:28.827
 the Americans revolving in Rhode Island.
 
 00:11:28.847 --> 00:11:29.948
 Yeah.
 
 00:11:29.969 --> 00:11:30.909
 It's trying to launch a
 
 00:11:30.929 --> 00:11:32.630
 diversionary attack into
 
 00:11:33.611 --> 00:11:34.793
 into Connecticut on the
 
 00:11:34.832 --> 00:11:36.094
 basis of the Battle of Rhode Island.
 
 00:11:36.114 --> 00:11:37.475
 So that's actually delayed, I believe,
 
 00:11:37.514 --> 00:11:38.216
 by poor weather.
 
 00:11:40.258 --> 00:11:41.499
 In seventeen seventy nine
 
 00:11:42.538 --> 00:11:43.419
 governor or general
 
 00:11:43.820 --> 00:11:45.541
 governor and General Tryon
 
 00:11:45.561 --> 00:11:48.001
 will launch a very vicious attack.
 
 00:11:48.023 --> 00:11:49.243
 He'll he'll hit New Haven.
 
 00:11:49.363 --> 00:11:50.943
 He'll hit Fairfield Hill at Norwalk.
 
 00:11:51.504 --> 00:11:52.625
 New London is next.
 
 00:11:53.264 --> 00:11:55.245
 But by that time they've had
 
 00:11:55.287 --> 00:11:56.126
 plenty of time to prepare.
 
 00:11:56.167 --> 00:11:56.866
 They see the threat.
 
 00:11:56.886 --> 00:11:57.327
 It's real.
 
 00:11:57.347 --> 00:11:58.648
 It's not just an imaginary
 
 00:11:58.668 --> 00:12:01.370
 or believe to come and so.
 
 00:12:02.212 --> 00:12:03.234
 They don't see this one coming.
 
 00:12:03.254 --> 00:12:05.076
 I mean, there is warning signs.
 
 00:12:05.136 --> 00:12:06.938
 There is a actual double
 
 00:12:07.038 --> 00:12:08.041
 agent who actually arrives
 
 00:12:08.081 --> 00:12:09.241
 at Ledyard's headquarters
 
 00:12:09.282 --> 00:12:11.304
 the night of and says, Arnold's coming.
 
 00:12:12.066 --> 00:12:14.288
 But Ledyard, I guess, hesitates,
 
 00:12:14.809 --> 00:12:16.150
 doesn't really do anything
 
 00:12:16.171 --> 00:12:17.452
 because maybe there's too
 
 00:12:17.472 --> 00:12:18.354
 many false alarms.
 
 00:12:18.394 --> 00:12:19.336
 Maybe he's concerned.
 
 00:12:19.982 --> 00:12:20.964
 But I would have loved for
 
 00:12:21.004 --> 00:12:22.304
 Leonard to at least issue
 
 00:12:22.664 --> 00:12:23.504
 preparatory orders.
 
 00:12:23.544 --> 00:12:24.225
 I would love to see.
 
 00:12:24.245 --> 00:12:25.427
 He would have called the
 
 00:12:25.447 --> 00:12:26.326
 guys who were on furlough,
 
 00:12:26.366 --> 00:12:28.769
 called those guys back in, posted guards,
 
 00:12:29.168 --> 00:12:29.869
 do something.
 
 00:12:30.549 --> 00:12:31.650
 But nothing was done.
 
 00:12:31.671 --> 00:12:33.172
 So then they woke up the next morning,
 
 00:12:33.192 --> 00:12:33.991
 and there's Arnold sitting
 
 00:12:34.032 --> 00:12:34.913
 at the mouth of the harbor.
 
 00:12:35.855 --> 00:12:36.537
 Wow.
 
 00:12:36.557 --> 00:12:38.698
 So then he does come into the harbor.
 
 00:12:38.739 --> 00:12:39.659
 And so what happens?
 
 00:12:39.679 --> 00:12:41.282
 What's his plan?
 
 00:12:42.283 --> 00:12:43.283
 The attack, actually,
 
 00:12:43.364 --> 00:12:44.785
 one of the fun things about
 
 00:12:44.806 --> 00:12:45.606
 those British letters in
 
 00:12:45.626 --> 00:12:46.607
 the newspapers is that it
 
 00:12:46.628 --> 00:12:47.589
 was supposed to be a night
 
 00:12:47.609 --> 00:12:49.770
 attack the previous day.
 
 00:12:51.013 --> 00:12:52.354
 They were supposed to land
 
 00:12:52.453 --> 00:12:53.575
 British forces on both
 
 00:12:53.595 --> 00:12:54.235
 sides of the river.
 
 00:12:54.336 --> 00:12:54.897
 Mm-hmm.
 
 00:12:55.277 --> 00:12:56.418
 and secure the forts before
 
 00:12:56.437 --> 00:12:57.099
 the militia could be
 
 00:12:57.139 --> 00:12:57.960
 alerted but there's some
 
 00:12:58.000 --> 00:12:59.360
 wind issues and they're not
 
 00:12:59.480 --> 00:13:01.663
 able to do that and so
 
 00:13:01.683 --> 00:13:02.985
 they're forced to land the
 
 00:13:03.024 --> 00:13:04.346
 next morning it's going to
 
 00:13:04.365 --> 00:13:05.427
 be a double attack it's
 
 00:13:05.506 --> 00:13:06.107
 they're going to launch
 
 00:13:06.268 --> 00:13:07.229
 half the british force is
 
 00:13:07.269 --> 00:13:08.049
 going to go after fort
 
 00:13:08.070 --> 00:13:09.250
 griswold which I argue is
 
 00:13:09.291 --> 00:13:11.994
 the key to the harbor and
 
 00:13:12.014 --> 00:13:13.755
 the other other detachment
 
 00:13:13.796 --> 00:13:14.976
 is under arnold himself is
 
 00:13:15.017 --> 00:13:15.758
 going to march into new
 
 00:13:15.817 --> 00:13:16.918
 london secure the forts
 
 00:13:17.509 --> 00:13:18.870
 once all the forts have been
 
 00:13:18.931 --> 00:13:19.871
 secured then the british
 
 00:13:19.932 --> 00:13:21.432
 navy can safely enter the
 
 00:13:21.472 --> 00:13:22.914
 harbor and they can take
 
 00:13:22.934 --> 00:13:23.774
 the privateers they could
 
 00:13:23.794 --> 00:13:24.917
 do battle the privateers
 
 00:13:25.537 --> 00:13:27.318
 but with that delay of the
 
 00:13:27.359 --> 00:13:28.900
 wind everything goes askew
 
 00:13:28.961 --> 00:13:29.802
 and the british navy is
 
 00:13:29.841 --> 00:13:30.802
 never actually able to
 
 00:13:30.883 --> 00:13:33.144
 enter the harbor because
 
 00:13:33.164 --> 00:13:34.846
 the privateers will escape upriver
 
 00:13:35.725 --> 00:13:36.326
 I see.
 
 00:13:36.346 --> 00:13:37.746
 Do they manage to engage them,
 
 00:13:37.807 --> 00:13:39.067
 get the privateers or do
 
 00:13:39.106 --> 00:13:40.226
 damage to the privateers?
 
 00:13:40.667 --> 00:13:40.927
 Yeah,
 
 00:13:40.947 --> 00:13:42.967
 there's about thirteen or fourteen
 
 00:13:43.008 --> 00:13:43.467
 privateers.
 
 00:13:43.488 --> 00:13:44.969
 I did a lot of research into
 
 00:13:45.009 --> 00:13:45.769
 figuring out which
 
 00:13:45.828 --> 00:13:46.729
 privateers were in the
 
 00:13:46.769 --> 00:13:47.769
 harbor at the time so I can
 
 00:13:47.789 --> 00:13:48.549
 account for all of them
 
 00:13:48.590 --> 00:13:49.929
 because apparently the
 
 00:13:49.950 --> 00:13:51.211
 British did it so fast that
 
 00:13:51.230 --> 00:13:52.770
 they never actually they
 
 00:13:52.811 --> 00:13:53.610
 just kind of gave it a
 
 00:13:53.671 --> 00:13:54.431
 guesstimate number.
 
 00:13:55.951 --> 00:13:57.432
 But we do, again,
 
 00:13:57.491 --> 00:13:58.572
 digitizing the newspapers,
 
 00:13:58.592 --> 00:13:59.552
 I was able to track down
 
 00:13:59.592 --> 00:14:00.653
 some of the prizes and some
 
 00:14:00.673 --> 00:14:02.494
 of the things and then people at least
 
 00:14:03.533 --> 00:14:04.693
 show them what was there and
 
 00:14:04.734 --> 00:14:05.673
 what might have been captured.
 
 00:14:05.693 --> 00:14:07.654
 And mostly prized vessels.
 
 00:14:07.674 --> 00:14:08.375
 These are the ones that were
 
 00:14:08.394 --> 00:14:09.296
 taken captive by the
 
 00:14:09.316 --> 00:14:10.216
 privateers and were sitting
 
 00:14:10.235 --> 00:14:10.697
 in the harbor.
 
 00:14:11.376 --> 00:14:12.616
 Most of the valuable privateers,
 
 00:14:12.657 --> 00:14:15.418
 they took the more valuable
 
 00:14:15.458 --> 00:14:16.078
 ships and they went to the
 
 00:14:16.119 --> 00:14:16.619
 river to save those.
 
 00:14:16.639 --> 00:14:18.080
 Wow, interesting.
 
 00:14:18.320 --> 00:14:20.240
 And then what happens to New London,
 
 00:14:20.280 --> 00:14:21.282
 the town?
 
 00:14:21.361 --> 00:14:22.241
 New London is burned.
 
 00:14:22.261 --> 00:14:24.222
 I mean, the waterfront is burned.
 
 00:14:25.844 --> 00:14:27.063
 Most of the initial damage
 
 00:14:27.105 --> 00:14:28.264
 is done to the waterfront,
 
 00:14:28.284 --> 00:14:29.485
 to the shipping, the warehouse,
 
 00:14:29.505 --> 00:14:30.926
 storehouses, things like that.
 
 00:14:32.650 --> 00:14:33.711
 Arnold, for some reason,
 
 00:14:33.772 --> 00:14:35.572
 has his American Legion,
 
 00:14:35.772 --> 00:14:37.113
 which is his loyalist unit.
 
 00:14:37.592 --> 00:14:38.734
 They're positioned in the
 
 00:14:38.774 --> 00:14:39.553
 northern part of town,
 
 00:14:39.594 --> 00:14:40.774
 the northeastern part of town.
 
 00:14:41.174 --> 00:14:42.235
 And they're a little bit rowdy.
 
 00:14:42.514 --> 00:14:43.495
 And they will actually start
 
 00:14:43.515 --> 00:14:44.336
 threatening civilians and
 
 00:14:44.416 --> 00:14:45.476
 start breaking the houses.
 
 00:14:45.996 --> 00:14:46.897
 So a lot of the stories
 
 00:14:46.917 --> 00:14:48.378
 about British burning
 
 00:14:48.418 --> 00:14:49.519
 things and throwing stuff
 
 00:14:49.578 --> 00:14:51.019
 is mostly due to them, I think.
 
 00:14:51.038 --> 00:14:52.299
 Nick?
 
 00:14:52.700 --> 00:14:54.600
 Yeah.
 
 00:14:54.640 --> 00:14:55.120
 Had Arnold,
 
 00:14:55.160 --> 00:14:56.481
 was he familiar with New London
 
 00:14:56.522 --> 00:14:57.322
 from before the war?
 
 00:14:57.662 --> 00:14:57.861
 Oh, yeah.
 
 00:14:57.902 --> 00:14:58.442
 He was there.
 
 00:14:58.602 --> 00:14:59.123
 And yeah,
 
 00:14:59.163 --> 00:15:00.604
 he was there a lot before the war.
 
 00:15:02.666 --> 00:15:04.368
 also I forgot to add it when
 
 00:15:04.388 --> 00:15:05.568
 the british withdrew they
 
 00:15:05.589 --> 00:15:06.688
 withdrew in such a hurry
 
 00:15:07.129 --> 00:15:08.071
 that they didn't allocate
 
 00:15:08.130 --> 00:15:10.011
 for everything they burned
 
 00:15:10.091 --> 00:15:11.253
 and it was about an hour's
 
 00:15:11.293 --> 00:15:12.975
 time between the british
 
 00:15:13.014 --> 00:15:14.615
 evacuation and when the
 
 00:15:14.635 --> 00:15:15.677
 american militia finally
 
 00:15:16.076 --> 00:15:17.498
 entered the town and by
 
 00:15:17.538 --> 00:15:18.499
 that time the fires had got
 
 00:15:18.538 --> 00:15:20.120
 out of control um there was
 
 00:15:20.139 --> 00:15:20.860
 a warehouse with some
 
 00:15:20.900 --> 00:15:22.282
 gunpowder down where the
 
 00:15:22.302 --> 00:15:23.722
 shaw mansion is today that
 
 00:15:23.863 --> 00:15:25.825
 blew and that most of the
 
 00:15:25.884 --> 00:15:26.826
 like I said the waterfront
 
 00:15:26.946 --> 00:15:28.746
 including many many civilian houses
 
 00:15:29.548 --> 00:15:30.528
 are now all ablaze.
 
 00:15:30.568 --> 00:15:31.649
 And that's, unfortunately,
 
 00:15:31.668 --> 00:15:32.250
 what people remember.
 
 00:15:32.269 --> 00:15:33.711
 They don't... Right.
 
 00:15:34.110 --> 00:15:34.211
 Yeah.
 
 00:15:34.910 --> 00:15:36.172
 Well, it is a memorable thing.
 
 00:15:36.192 --> 00:15:36.993
 And also,
 
 00:15:37.052 --> 00:15:38.994
 there's the legend of the
 
 00:15:39.014 --> 00:15:40.335
 massacre at Fort Griswold.
 
 00:15:40.375 --> 00:15:41.455
 I mean, the fighting at the fort.
 
 00:15:41.475 --> 00:15:42.456
 Can you tell us a little bit
 
 00:15:42.515 --> 00:15:43.196
 more about that?
 
 00:15:43.235 --> 00:15:44.197
 What happens at the fort?
 
 00:15:44.216 --> 00:15:46.317
 Yeah,
 
 00:15:46.337 --> 00:15:48.119
 that story always hit me the wrong...
 
 00:15:48.240 --> 00:15:50.120
 I read it, and I read it, and I read it,
 
 00:15:50.140 --> 00:15:50.461
 and I'm like,
 
 00:15:50.921 --> 00:15:52.442
 something does not make sense about this.
 
 00:15:52.481 --> 00:15:52.662
 I mean,
 
 00:15:52.701 --> 00:15:54.663
 how does a fight this violent and
 
 00:15:54.703 --> 00:15:56.124
 so bad just stop?
 
 00:15:56.524 --> 00:15:58.285
 So the two can have a conversation...
 
 00:16:00.573 --> 00:16:02.177
 And I originally had an
 
 00:16:02.216 --> 00:16:04.461
 interpretation that Ledyard
 
 00:16:04.480 --> 00:16:05.984
 was not trying to surrender the fort,
 
 00:16:06.004 --> 00:16:06.946
 but actually he was leading
 
 00:16:06.966 --> 00:16:08.307
 a counterattack to plug a hole.
 
 00:16:09.337 --> 00:16:10.818
 But that changed over time
 
 00:16:10.839 --> 00:16:12.058
 because there was there was
 
 00:16:12.099 --> 00:16:14.059
 too many primary sources of
 
 00:16:14.120 --> 00:16:15.860
 guys saying he was trying to surrender.
 
 00:16:16.441 --> 00:16:17.981
 So I had to be a truth in there somewhere.
 
 00:16:18.402 --> 00:16:20.102
 And so what I came up with was that he was,
 
 00:16:20.623 --> 00:16:20.822
 you know,
 
 00:16:20.842 --> 00:16:22.283
 this this fort is only fifty
 
 00:16:22.303 --> 00:16:22.783
 yards across.
 
 00:16:22.823 --> 00:16:24.565
 It's a small place and there's like five,
 
 00:16:24.664 --> 00:16:26.125
 six, seven hundred soldiers.
 
 00:16:26.885 --> 00:16:28.206
 Absolute chaos.
 
 00:16:28.787 --> 00:16:30.047
 And I go there today and I'm like,
 
 00:16:30.307 --> 00:16:31.628
 I can't imagine so many people.
 
 00:16:32.408 --> 00:16:33.889
 And how in the world are you
 
 00:16:33.990 --> 00:16:35.289
 able to communicate orders?
 
 00:16:36.331 --> 00:16:37.530
 Guys don't want to surrender.
 
 00:16:37.571 --> 00:16:39.011
 They're fighting for self-preservation.
 
 00:16:39.111 --> 00:16:40.192
 The British come in the fort,
 
 00:16:40.212 --> 00:16:42.374
 which the last attack into the fort,
 
 00:16:43.234 --> 00:16:44.495
 I don't think was done on purpose.
 
 00:16:44.534 --> 00:16:45.294
 I think it was done
 
 00:16:45.455 --> 00:16:46.855
 spontaneously by the way
 
 00:16:46.895 --> 00:16:47.916
 the British officers are
 
 00:16:47.936 --> 00:16:49.897
 reacting after it happened.
 
 00:16:50.361 --> 00:16:51.202
 They lost control.
 
 00:16:51.243 --> 00:16:52.344
 And as they enter the fort,
 
 00:16:52.724 --> 00:16:53.884
 some of the officers get hit.
 
 00:16:53.904 --> 00:16:54.884
 So the British are like, no,
 
 00:16:54.904 --> 00:16:55.926
 we're not taking prisoners.
 
 00:16:56.566 --> 00:16:56.907
 You know,
 
 00:16:56.947 --> 00:16:58.567
 some Americans are trying to surrender.
 
 00:16:59.629 --> 00:17:01.210
 Leonard, I think, is among them trying to,
 
 00:17:01.230 --> 00:17:02.370
 but he's unsuccessful.
 
 00:17:02.490 --> 00:17:03.630
 Other Americans are fighting
 
 00:17:03.671 --> 00:17:04.872
 back there in the barracks building.
 
 00:17:05.212 --> 00:17:06.452
 It's just it's just absolute.
 
 00:17:06.472 --> 00:17:07.374
 I don't know how in the
 
 00:17:07.394 --> 00:17:08.255
 world they were able to
 
 00:17:08.295 --> 00:17:09.756
 regain any kind of.
 
 00:17:10.538 --> 00:17:11.759
 order after what happened there.
 
 00:17:11.878 --> 00:17:12.859
 Even the British officer,
 
 00:17:12.900 --> 00:17:13.760
 another British officer in
 
 00:17:13.780 --> 00:17:14.441
 the one of the letters,
 
 00:17:14.461 --> 00:17:16.702
 talks about it was unspeakable horror.
 
 00:17:17.604 --> 00:17:19.506
 It was horrible for like ten minutes.
 
 00:17:19.945 --> 00:17:20.987
 It was just horrible.
 
 00:17:22.688 --> 00:17:23.509
 And the descriptions of the
 
 00:17:23.548 --> 00:17:24.650
 fort afterwards, I mean,
 
 00:17:24.710 --> 00:17:25.530
 some of the pensions
 
 00:17:25.671 --> 00:17:26.672
 started talking about, you know,
 
 00:17:26.751 --> 00:17:27.672
 slipping on blood.
 
 00:17:28.313 --> 00:17:28.532
 And I just,
 
 00:17:29.134 --> 00:17:30.335
 I can't imagine what that even
 
 00:17:30.394 --> 00:17:32.596
 looked like either.
 
 00:17:32.656 --> 00:17:34.117
 About how many men were
 
 00:17:34.218 --> 00:17:36.700
 killed or captured in Fort Griswold?
 
 00:17:37.832 --> 00:17:39.393
 I want to say there's probably well,
 
 00:17:39.432 --> 00:17:40.353
 if you include the wounded,
 
 00:17:40.373 --> 00:17:42.013
 there's over probably about
 
 00:17:42.433 --> 00:17:44.994
 I think I counted eight, eight,
 
 00:17:45.174 --> 00:17:47.395
 seventy nine killed and
 
 00:17:47.516 --> 00:17:48.636
 over one hundred wounded
 
 00:17:48.757 --> 00:17:49.517
 and taken prisoner.
 
 00:17:50.238 --> 00:17:52.759
 So they the real how they
 
 00:17:53.078 --> 00:17:55.160
 told the story was that, you know,
 
 00:17:55.240 --> 00:17:56.279
 eighty guys or ninety guys
 
 00:17:56.299 --> 00:17:58.101
 got killed and only seventy survived.
 
 00:17:58.121 --> 00:17:59.142
 But they don't ever account
 
 00:17:59.162 --> 00:18:01.142
 for all the prisoners that were wounded.
 
 00:18:01.162 --> 00:18:03.042
 It wasn't a complete and utter massacre.
 
 00:18:03.282 --> 00:18:04.104
 It was pretty close,
 
 00:18:04.163 --> 00:18:06.724
 but it was it was not as.
 
 00:18:08.271 --> 00:18:08.731
 One-sided,
 
 00:18:08.772 --> 00:18:09.893
 as you would imagine it would be.
 
 00:18:10.453 --> 00:18:12.414
 Were there many British casualties?
 
 00:18:12.474 --> 00:18:12.555
 Oh,
 
 00:18:12.595 --> 00:18:15.497
 the British casualties were just as high.
 
 00:18:15.576 --> 00:18:17.178
 I think they lost eight or nine officers.
 
 00:18:17.198 --> 00:18:19.880
 They lost their commander, Colonel Ayers,
 
 00:18:19.920 --> 00:18:21.101
 wounded in the first attack.
 
 00:18:22.362 --> 00:18:23.383
 And then Major Montgomery,
 
 00:18:23.482 --> 00:18:24.623
 who's in second in command,
 
 00:18:25.124 --> 00:18:26.644
 he'll scale the wall and he'll get killed,
 
 00:18:26.684 --> 00:18:28.605
 and they'll be really angry over that.
 
 00:18:29.666 --> 00:18:31.188
 And another one of the
 
 00:18:31.228 --> 00:18:32.209
 letters that I found,
 
 00:18:32.348 --> 00:18:33.088
 the British talk about
 
 00:18:33.209 --> 00:18:34.089
 actually taking
 
 00:18:34.150 --> 00:18:35.570
 Montgomery's body over the wall
 
 00:18:36.347 --> 00:18:37.410
 And he got to the bottom of the wall,
 
 00:18:37.430 --> 00:18:38.472
 and that's where he expired.
 
 00:18:38.492 --> 00:18:40.737
 Oh, my goodness.
 
 00:18:40.798 --> 00:18:42.079
 We're talking with Matt Reardon,
 
 00:18:42.320 --> 00:18:43.884
 author of The Trader's Homecoming,
 
 00:18:43.923 --> 00:18:45.748
 Benedict Arnold's Raid on New London,
 
 00:18:45.788 --> 00:18:46.169
 Connecticut.
 
 00:18:50.203 --> 00:18:51.944
 long time executive director
 
 00:18:52.125 --> 00:18:54.746
 of the Connecticut Civil
 
 00:18:54.786 --> 00:18:56.666
 War Museum and the New
 
 00:18:56.727 --> 00:18:57.826
 England Civil War Museum
 
 00:18:57.846 --> 00:19:00.348
 and Research Center, as well as the,
 
 00:19:01.548 --> 00:19:02.690
 is a command historian for
 
 00:19:02.730 --> 00:19:04.330
 Connecticut's military department.
 
 00:19:04.911 --> 00:19:07.132
 And so let me ask,
 
 00:19:07.152 --> 00:19:08.292
 we'll get back to Fort
 
 00:19:08.313 --> 00:19:09.413
 Griswold in New London,
 
 00:19:09.452 --> 00:19:10.173
 but do you have another
 
 00:19:10.212 --> 00:19:11.213
 project now that you've
 
 00:19:11.433 --> 00:19:12.173
 finished this book?
 
 00:19:13.954 --> 00:19:15.655
 I have several things in the
 
 00:19:15.695 --> 00:19:16.276
 works right now.
 
 00:19:17.756 --> 00:19:18.556
 I'm not really going to talk
 
 00:19:18.576 --> 00:19:20.057
 about it because I like to keep people,
 
 00:19:20.076 --> 00:19:22.037
 yeah.
 
 00:19:22.096 --> 00:19:24.157
 I'm definitely staying in the Connecticut.
 
 00:19:24.337 --> 00:19:25.278
 There's so many Connecticut
 
 00:19:25.377 --> 00:19:26.377
 actions and so much stuff
 
 00:19:26.397 --> 00:19:27.157
 that's never really been
 
 00:19:27.178 --> 00:19:29.278
 told that I'm really kind of,
 
 00:19:29.419 --> 00:19:30.598
 I like that localness and I
 
 00:19:30.638 --> 00:19:31.479
 like the fact that no one's
 
 00:19:31.499 --> 00:19:32.239
 touched it before.
 
 00:19:33.480 --> 00:19:34.839
 It's really interesting.
 
 00:19:34.920 --> 00:19:35.460
 I mean,
 
 00:19:35.500 --> 00:19:37.161
 Connecticut's role in this because
 
 00:19:37.221 --> 00:19:38.441
 Connecticut is supplying
 
 00:19:38.480 --> 00:19:39.901
 the Army and while it does
 
 00:19:39.921 --> 00:19:41.321
 have some very skilled
 
 00:19:41.382 --> 00:19:42.662
 military leadership,
 
 00:19:42.721 --> 00:19:44.021
 but then in many ways,
 
 00:19:44.041 --> 00:19:45.182
 Benedict Arnold is like
 
 00:19:45.202 --> 00:19:46.762
 their most charismatic general, right?
 
 00:19:48.940 --> 00:19:49.180
 I mean,
 
 00:19:49.200 --> 00:19:50.780
 there are lots of great stories in
 
 00:19:50.840 --> 00:19:56.865
 Connecticut in the Revolutionary War.
 
 00:19:56.884 --> 00:19:57.746
 Do you have another?
 
 00:19:57.786 --> 00:19:58.866
 Oh, I'm sorry.
 
 00:19:58.886 --> 00:19:59.326
 I didn't realize.
 
 00:19:59.346 --> 00:19:59.547
 Yeah.
 
 00:20:00.166 --> 00:20:00.407
 Yeah.
 
 00:20:00.448 --> 00:20:02.028
 I mean, we have many different leaders.
 
 00:20:02.068 --> 00:20:02.669
 I mean, obviously,
 
 00:20:02.689 --> 00:20:03.490
 we have Benedict Arnold.
 
 00:20:03.529 --> 00:20:04.630
 We have Israel Putnam.
 
 00:20:05.611 --> 00:20:06.372
 Oh, yeah.
 
 00:20:06.392 --> 00:20:06.991
 We have Meigs.
 
 00:20:07.031 --> 00:20:09.753
 We have a lot of Samuel Parsons.
 
 00:20:11.300 --> 00:20:12.362
 Jonathan Latimer, again,
 
 00:20:12.422 --> 00:20:13.241
 one of my favorite guys.
 
 00:20:13.281 --> 00:20:14.002
 I got to meet some of his
 
 00:20:14.022 --> 00:20:16.804
 family members during the research phase.
 
 00:20:17.285 --> 00:20:18.105
 I went to Saratoga and
 
 00:20:18.125 --> 00:20:18.806
 followed him around.
 
 00:20:18.885 --> 00:20:21.287
 I like to add his part of the story.
 
 00:20:21.567 --> 00:20:23.248
 I like to tell his part.
 
 00:20:23.268 --> 00:20:23.989
 His part of the story about
 
 00:20:24.028 --> 00:20:25.269
 New London has never been told before,
 
 00:20:25.308 --> 00:20:26.009
 so I think he's really
 
 00:20:26.069 --> 00:20:26.849
 underappreciated as well.
 
 00:20:26.869 --> 00:20:27.069
 Very good.
 
 00:20:27.089 --> 00:20:32.574
 Now, how did Fort Nonsense get its name?
 
 00:20:32.594 --> 00:20:34.255
 Fort Nonsense is not an official name.
 
 00:20:34.575 --> 00:20:34.734
 Okay.
 
 00:20:37.934 --> 00:20:38.796
 It was originally called by
 
 00:20:38.855 --> 00:20:39.655
 military and government,
 
 00:20:39.675 --> 00:20:40.797
 it was called the Town Hill Fort,
 
 00:20:40.876 --> 00:20:41.797
 the Town Hill Battery,
 
 00:20:42.257 --> 00:20:43.438
 but the militia who made it
 
 00:20:44.018 --> 00:20:45.038
 did not understand it,
 
 00:20:45.419 --> 00:20:46.279
 did not understand why are
 
 00:20:46.299 --> 00:20:47.660
 we building a fort on this hill?
 
 00:20:48.641 --> 00:20:50.221
 So they started calling it Fort Nonsense,
 
 00:20:50.801 --> 00:20:51.722
 and that's how it got its name,
 
 00:20:52.143 --> 00:20:55.464
 because it was utter nonsense to them.
 
 00:20:55.505 --> 00:20:57.806
 So after the battle,
 
 00:20:57.846 --> 00:20:59.467
 so it seems like a real
 
 00:20:59.527 --> 00:21:01.428
 disaster for the American.
 
 00:21:01.667 --> 00:21:04.690
 So what happens to Cementhus
 
 00:21:04.730 --> 00:21:06.230
 in memory after the battle?
 
 00:21:07.594 --> 00:21:07.753
 Well,
 
 00:21:07.875 --> 00:21:08.935
 one of the interesting things I
 
 00:21:08.955 --> 00:21:10.519
 uncovered is I started looking at,
 
 00:21:10.638 --> 00:21:12.422
 obviously, there's a propaganda campaign,
 
 00:21:12.442 --> 00:21:13.384
 which the book goes into in
 
 00:21:13.403 --> 00:21:14.705
 a lot of detail about how
 
 00:21:15.615 --> 00:21:17.435
 that the story got told as it is today.
 
 00:21:17.476 --> 00:21:18.676
 But if you look at the condition,
 
 00:21:18.737 --> 00:21:19.877
 why would there need to be
 
 00:21:19.897 --> 00:21:21.038
 a propaganda campaign?
 
 00:21:21.919 --> 00:21:22.459
 Some interesting,
 
 00:21:22.579 --> 00:21:24.560
 Connecticut was bankrupt in one.
 
 00:21:24.641 --> 00:21:25.560
 It had,
 
 00:21:25.682 --> 00:21:27.522
 it can't fill its continental army
 
 00:21:27.563 --> 00:21:27.962
 quotas.
 
 00:21:28.022 --> 00:21:28.884
 It's having a really,
 
 00:21:28.923 --> 00:21:29.903
 really difficult time.
 
 00:21:30.424 --> 00:21:31.925
 There's a possible mutiny of
 
 00:21:31.965 --> 00:21:34.807
 the Connecticut line about a month,
 
 00:21:35.067 --> 00:21:35.688
 maybe a couple of weeks
 
 00:21:35.728 --> 00:21:36.508
 before the attack.
 
 00:21:36.608 --> 00:21:37.648
 Governor Trumbull actually
 
 00:21:37.689 --> 00:21:39.490
 goes to out West towards
 
 00:21:40.030 --> 00:21:40.691
 where the Connecticut
 
 00:21:40.711 --> 00:21:41.451
 troops are on peace kill
 
 00:21:41.471 --> 00:21:42.992
 and delivers silver in person.
 
 00:21:43.633 --> 00:21:45.034
 So there, there's a lot of like,
 
 00:21:45.469 --> 00:21:46.351
 There's a lot of tension here,
 
 00:21:46.371 --> 00:21:46.992
 so they don't really know
 
 00:21:47.012 --> 00:21:47.594
 what's going to happen.
 
 00:21:47.615 --> 00:21:48.676
 The war is at a stalemate.
 
 00:21:48.798 --> 00:21:49.799
 No one really knows what's
 
 00:21:49.819 --> 00:21:50.662
 going to happen yet because
 
 00:21:50.682 --> 00:21:51.825
 Yorktown hasn't happened yet.
 
 00:21:52.807 --> 00:21:54.732
 And so, yeah, they take this story and
 
 00:21:55.173 --> 00:21:57.096
 I think Governor Trumbull was very happy.
 
 00:21:57.155 --> 00:21:58.175
 He was like, oh, Arnold's here.
 
 00:21:58.436 --> 00:21:59.557
 Everyone hates Arnold.
 
 00:21:59.857 --> 00:22:01.138
 Let's use this to our advantage.
 
 00:22:01.159 --> 00:22:02.319
 And he sends one of his friends,
 
 00:22:02.359 --> 00:22:03.079
 Thomas Mumford,
 
 00:22:03.099 --> 00:22:04.340
 to go down and investigate
 
 00:22:04.361 --> 00:22:05.142
 what's going on.
 
 00:22:05.602 --> 00:22:07.242
 And he wants to authenticate
 
 00:22:07.262 --> 00:22:09.785
 the stories and improve them if need be.
 
 00:22:10.506 --> 00:22:11.487
 So I'm like, improve them?
 
 00:22:11.626 --> 00:22:13.647
 This is a horrible attack.
 
 00:22:13.969 --> 00:22:15.450
 Why would you need to improve this?
 
 00:22:16.089 --> 00:22:18.511
 And so I think that's where
 
 00:22:18.531 --> 00:22:19.512
 it really starts to take hold.
 
 00:22:20.469 --> 00:22:21.690
 That's amazing.
 
 00:22:21.829 --> 00:22:22.770
 And so the governor is
 
 00:22:22.830 --> 00:22:25.393
 working to improve the story to make it.
 
 00:22:25.472 --> 00:22:30.096
 That's a great operation.
 
 00:22:31.538 --> 00:22:33.940
 So the town, I mean,
 
 00:22:33.980 --> 00:22:34.921
 Connecticut is in really
 
 00:22:34.941 --> 00:22:36.342
 tough shape in seventeen eighty one.
 
 00:22:36.801 --> 00:22:38.483
 What turns it around or how
 
 00:22:38.503 --> 00:22:40.464
 does the town come back after this?
 
 00:22:41.026 --> 00:22:42.126
 New London won't come back
 
 00:22:42.207 --> 00:22:43.847
 arguably until the whaling industry.
 
 00:22:44.167 --> 00:22:44.308
 OK.
 
 00:22:45.208 --> 00:22:46.828
 so and I mean the privateers
 
 00:22:46.888 --> 00:22:48.449
 continue one of the purpose
 
 00:22:48.469 --> 00:22:49.309
 of the attack was to
 
 00:22:49.349 --> 00:22:50.349
 obviously take and destroy
 
 00:22:50.390 --> 00:22:51.290
 the privateers not to
 
 00:22:51.330 --> 00:22:52.391
 mention pull washington
 
 00:22:52.431 --> 00:22:53.371
 away from attacking new
 
 00:22:53.411 --> 00:22:54.971
 york but the privateers
 
 00:22:55.071 --> 00:22:56.153
 there's a joke I think I
 
 00:22:56.192 --> 00:22:57.032
 think I put it in the book
 
 00:22:57.053 --> 00:22:59.294
 like it's um from an irish
 
 00:22:59.354 --> 00:23:00.834
 newspaper you know it was
 
 00:23:00.874 --> 00:23:01.914
 quoting macbeth you know we
 
 00:23:01.934 --> 00:23:02.855
 cut the head off the snake
 
 00:23:02.875 --> 00:23:03.695
 but it'll fill its head
 
 00:23:03.736 --> 00:23:06.037
 it'll fill itself yeah yeah
 
 00:23:06.076 --> 00:23:06.777
 the privateers just
 
 00:23:06.817 --> 00:23:09.958
 continue onward yeah yeah
 
 00:23:09.978 --> 00:23:10.858
 yeah you know earlier you
 
 00:23:10.878 --> 00:23:11.838
 had an article in the
 
 00:23:11.878 --> 00:23:12.679
 journal of the american
 
 00:23:12.719 --> 00:23:13.819
 revolution about two guys
 
 00:23:13.859 --> 00:23:14.440
 who were taking part
 
 00:23:19.513 --> 00:23:22.214
 after their deaths to put on
 
 00:23:22.234 --> 00:23:24.016
 the list of men who were
 
 00:23:24.076 --> 00:23:24.856
 taken to Fort Griswold.
 
 00:23:24.876 --> 00:23:25.676
 Yeah, that probably,
 
 00:23:26.096 --> 00:23:26.917
 they returned about the
 
 00:23:26.958 --> 00:23:28.378
 same time the prisoners returned.
 
 00:23:28.398 --> 00:23:29.739
 I think that's how they got on the list.
 
 00:23:29.759 --> 00:23:30.619
 Yeah, yeah.
 
 00:23:30.680 --> 00:23:31.759
 And I was really kind of sad
 
 00:23:31.779 --> 00:23:32.861
 because I'd heard those stories.
 
 00:23:32.921 --> 00:23:33.961
 I had a picture of one of them,
 
 00:23:34.040 --> 00:23:34.821
 and I was like, all right,
 
 00:23:34.842 --> 00:23:35.662
 I want a picture of a guy.
 
 00:23:36.323 --> 00:23:37.103
 And then I was like,
 
 00:23:37.383 --> 00:23:38.123
 something's not right here.
 
 00:23:38.143 --> 00:23:39.683
 Yeah, yeah.
 
 00:23:39.723 --> 00:23:41.224
 And even like Solomon Tiff,
 
 00:23:41.265 --> 00:23:42.385
 he and his pension never
 
 00:23:42.425 --> 00:23:43.625
 talked about being at Fort Griswold.
 
 00:23:43.885 --> 00:23:45.106
 He mentioned everything.
 
 00:23:45.307 --> 00:23:45.586
 Right.
 
 00:23:45.606 --> 00:23:46.728
 But he never mentioned that.
 
 00:23:47.388 --> 00:23:48.230
 It's really an amazing
 
 00:23:48.269 --> 00:23:49.851
 record that he has of service.
 
 00:23:50.090 --> 00:23:51.112
 You know,
 
 00:23:51.132 --> 00:23:52.894
 you lose track of how many places
 
 00:23:52.933 --> 00:23:54.394
 these guys had been and how
 
 00:23:54.414 --> 00:23:55.395
 many different kinds of
 
 00:23:55.415 --> 00:23:56.396
 service they had been in
 
 00:23:56.416 --> 00:23:58.018
 the course of the war.
 
 00:23:58.057 --> 00:24:00.079
 No one served us once.
 
 00:24:02.982 --> 00:24:04.183
 I think Jonathan told us
 
 00:24:04.203 --> 00:24:05.325
 that he had an ancestor who
 
 00:24:05.345 --> 00:24:06.105
 was at Fort Griswold.
 
 00:24:06.144 --> 00:24:07.686
 We'll have to hear more about that.
 
 00:24:08.446 --> 00:24:08.847
 As you said,
 
 00:24:08.867 --> 00:24:10.990
 you mentioned Latimer's descendants.
 
 00:24:11.009 --> 00:24:12.490
 There must be other descendants of people.
 
 00:24:14.324 --> 00:24:15.404
 I talked with Major William
 
 00:24:15.444 --> 00:24:17.027
 Montgomery's descendants in Ireland.
 
 00:24:18.007 --> 00:24:18.907
 I was begging them for a
 
 00:24:18.968 --> 00:24:19.788
 portrait or something,
 
 00:24:19.828 --> 00:24:20.730
 but I didn't get what I... Oh,
 
 00:24:20.750 --> 00:24:22.592
 that's too bad.
 
 00:24:22.632 --> 00:24:24.073
 Yeah, I looked into his relative.
 
 00:24:24.413 --> 00:24:25.835
 I don't really know what...
 
 00:24:25.855 --> 00:24:27.195
 I didn't come across his name.
 
 00:24:28.217 --> 00:24:30.759
 If he's from Norwich,
 
 00:24:30.798 --> 00:24:31.720
 like the record said he was,
 
 00:24:31.759 --> 00:24:34.762
 he probably came to New London or...
 
 00:24:35.542 --> 00:24:36.463
 In the middle of the attack
 
 00:24:36.483 --> 00:24:37.523
 is the New London, I'm sorry,
 
 00:24:37.544 --> 00:24:38.684
 the Norwich Militia.
 
 00:24:38.704 --> 00:24:39.806
 They're in the XX Regiment
 
 00:24:39.826 --> 00:24:40.605
 of Connecticut Militia.
 
 00:24:40.645 --> 00:24:41.586
 They'll arrive around one
 
 00:24:41.606 --> 00:24:42.647
 o'clock in the afternoon
 
 00:24:43.528 --> 00:24:45.309
 after a very long march from Norwich.
 
 00:24:46.349 --> 00:24:48.852
 They don't really
 
 00:24:48.912 --> 00:24:49.813
 participate in the action.
 
 00:24:50.993 --> 00:24:51.854
 How are they getting word to
 
 00:24:51.913 --> 00:24:52.734
 Norwich or to the other
 
 00:24:52.775 --> 00:24:54.036
 militia companies?
 
 00:24:54.715 --> 00:24:55.916
 They send riders out very
 
 00:24:55.977 --> 00:24:56.676
 early in the morning.
 
 00:24:57.557 --> 00:25:00.259
 The alarm guns will go off and then
 
 00:25:01.391 --> 00:25:02.872
 There's a whole story with the alarm guns.
 
 00:25:02.932 --> 00:25:05.753
 But just in case that they
 
 00:25:05.773 --> 00:25:06.574
 don't hear the guns,
 
 00:25:06.855 --> 00:25:07.934
 they're sending express riders.
 
 00:25:07.954 --> 00:25:09.115
 And I think the express
 
 00:25:09.155 --> 00:25:09.997
 rider that's being sent to
 
 00:25:10.037 --> 00:25:10.696
 Governor Trumbull,
 
 00:25:10.717 --> 00:25:11.917
 who's believed to be in Lebanon,
 
 00:25:11.938 --> 00:25:13.719
 Connecticut, actually will bypass,
 
 00:25:13.739 --> 00:25:15.839
 will go through Norwich and
 
 00:25:15.880 --> 00:25:16.580
 start to let them know
 
 00:25:16.601 --> 00:25:18.061
 what's going on and continue on,
 
 00:25:18.122 --> 00:25:19.001
 only to find out Governor
 
 00:25:19.021 --> 00:25:19.762
 Trumbull's not there.
 
 00:25:19.782 --> 00:25:20.643
 He's actually in Hartford.
 
 00:25:20.663 --> 00:25:21.023
 Oh, wow.
 
 00:25:23.605 --> 00:25:24.826
 And Connecticut's capital rotated, too,
 
 00:25:24.846 --> 00:25:26.366
 between Hartford and New Haven.
 
 00:25:26.386 --> 00:25:30.009
 So finding where the governor is...
 
 00:25:31.633 --> 00:25:33.035
 One of the oddities of our state, yeah.
 
 00:25:33.335 --> 00:25:34.155
 And not to mention, I mean,
 
 00:25:34.195 --> 00:25:35.477
 when the legislature was
 
 00:25:35.576 --> 00:25:36.999
 only in session a few times a year.
 
 00:25:37.559 --> 00:25:38.701
 So the governor may not even
 
 00:25:38.721 --> 00:25:39.561
 been in either place.
 
 00:25:39.602 --> 00:25:41.042
 He was probably at his home
 
 00:25:41.063 --> 00:25:41.804
 in Lebanon where he had a
 
 00:25:41.844 --> 00:25:43.445
 war office where our
 
 00:25:43.506 --> 00:25:44.666
 council of safety met.
 
 00:25:49.016 --> 00:25:50.217
 Johnson tells us there's a
 
 00:25:50.277 --> 00:25:51.837
 monument built at Fort Griswold.
 
 00:25:51.958 --> 00:25:54.599
 It was actually built fifty years later,
 
 00:25:54.680 --> 00:25:55.760
 between eighteen twenty six
 
 00:25:55.780 --> 00:25:56.541
 and eighteen thirty.
 
 00:25:56.561 --> 00:25:57.721
 Is that the first monument
 
 00:25:57.761 --> 00:25:59.403
 to the Battle of Fort Griswold?
 
 00:25:59.443 --> 00:26:00.463
 Or has there been another
 
 00:26:01.005 --> 00:26:01.865
 memorial earlier?
 
 00:26:02.865 --> 00:26:04.426
 That probably is the oldest one.
 
 00:26:04.688 --> 00:26:05.627
 And interesting to note,
 
 00:26:05.667 --> 00:26:07.650
 a lot of the descendants are survivors.
 
 00:26:07.750 --> 00:26:09.290
 The veterans actually attended that one.
 
 00:26:10.433 --> 00:26:11.734
 And they all got to mingle together,
 
 00:26:11.755 --> 00:26:12.714
 probably for the first time
 
 00:26:12.775 --> 00:26:13.415
 since the battle.
 
 00:26:13.455 --> 00:26:15.376
 And so some stories came out of that time,
 
 00:26:15.416 --> 00:26:15.616
 too.
 
 00:26:17.499 --> 00:26:19.640
 The monument didn't have a cap at the time,
 
 00:26:19.901 --> 00:26:20.340
 originally.
 
 00:26:20.941 --> 00:26:22.603
 It had like a prominent,
 
 00:26:22.682 --> 00:26:24.463
 I don't know what you want to call it,
 
 00:26:24.483 --> 00:26:25.345
 a tower where you can see things.
 
 00:26:25.384 --> 00:26:26.005
 Now it's capped,
 
 00:26:26.085 --> 00:26:28.067
 but it still stands there today.
 
 00:26:28.086 --> 00:26:31.169
 Yeah, you see it when you go to London,
 
 00:26:31.189 --> 00:26:31.249
 yes.
 
 00:26:33.342 --> 00:26:34.762
 Now, had there been one, I mean,
 
 00:26:34.782 --> 00:26:35.643
 you mentioned the governor
 
 00:26:35.663 --> 00:26:36.502
 wanting to improve the
 
 00:26:36.542 --> 00:26:38.243
 story just after it happened.
 
 00:26:38.304 --> 00:26:39.244
 Had there been other
 
 00:26:39.305 --> 00:26:43.145
 histories of the battle before yours?
 
 00:26:43.246 --> 00:26:43.406
 Yeah,
 
 00:26:43.426 --> 00:26:44.606
 there have been several that came out
 
 00:26:44.686 --> 00:26:45.667
 and most of them just
 
 00:26:45.708 --> 00:26:46.807
 repeated the same stories
 
 00:26:46.907 --> 00:26:47.728
 over and over again.
 
 00:26:47.748 --> 00:26:49.108
 And it wasn't anything new.
 
 00:26:49.148 --> 00:26:49.969
 And some of them actually
 
 00:26:49.989 --> 00:26:51.009
 started to change things.
 
 00:26:51.109 --> 00:26:51.670
 And that really,
 
 00:26:52.250 --> 00:26:53.371
 that kind of irritated me as a story.
 
 00:26:53.391 --> 00:26:54.411
 I'm like, why are you, you know,
 
 00:26:54.912 --> 00:26:55.791
 like there's a group of
 
 00:26:55.872 --> 00:26:56.932
 Loyalist militia called the
 
 00:26:56.952 --> 00:26:59.134
 Associated Loyalists under
 
 00:26:59.213 --> 00:27:00.894
 a Lieutenant Colonel Joshua Upham.
 
 00:27:01.994 --> 00:27:02.095
 And
 
 00:27:03.031 --> 00:27:04.373
 I'm so tired of them saying
 
 00:27:04.393 --> 00:27:05.313
 they were from New Jersey.
 
 00:27:05.333 --> 00:27:06.413
 They were not from New Jersey.
 
 00:27:06.534 --> 00:27:08.334
 Upham was from Brookfield, Massachusetts.
 
 00:27:09.134 --> 00:27:10.035
 And the command had a lot of
 
 00:27:10.075 --> 00:27:11.256
 Massachusetts and a lot of
 
 00:27:11.336 --> 00:27:13.336
 actually Connecticut loyalists in it.
 
 00:27:13.355 --> 00:27:14.737
 So for them, it was like personal.
 
 00:27:15.297 --> 00:27:15.856
 So, you know.
 
 00:27:16.597 --> 00:27:17.597
 So what did they want to say?
 
 00:27:17.617 --> 00:27:18.499
 They're from New Jersey.
 
 00:27:19.298 --> 00:27:20.278
 They got them confused with
 
 00:27:20.318 --> 00:27:21.640
 another loyalist unit that
 
 00:27:21.660 --> 00:27:23.701
 was on the raid that was from New Jersey.
 
 00:27:23.840 --> 00:27:24.080
 Okay.
 
 00:27:25.082 --> 00:27:25.662
 I didn't know if there was
 
 00:27:25.682 --> 00:27:26.303
 some other thing,
 
 00:27:26.482 --> 00:27:27.682
 something else going on with that.
 
 00:27:27.702 --> 00:27:28.823
 We're talking with Matt Reardon,
 
 00:27:28.982 --> 00:27:30.683
 author of The Trader's Homecoming,
 
 00:27:30.703 --> 00:27:32.525
 Benedict Arnold's Raid on New London,
 
 00:27:32.565 --> 00:27:33.125
 Connecticut.
 
 00:27:34.345 --> 00:27:36.705
 So after he burns the town,
 
 00:27:36.746 --> 00:27:39.346
 they take Fort Griswold, Fort Trumbull.
 
 00:27:39.467 --> 00:27:40.267
 What does Arnold do?
 
 00:27:41.567 --> 00:27:44.107
 They retreat to their ships, obviously,
 
 00:27:44.188 --> 00:27:46.068
 and then they make plans to
 
 00:27:46.128 --> 00:27:46.989
 return to New York.
 
 00:27:47.828 --> 00:27:48.170
 But again,
 
 00:27:48.210 --> 00:27:49.529
 the wind is not going to be very
 
 00:27:49.569 --> 00:27:50.450
 cooperative with them,
 
 00:27:51.211 --> 00:27:53.951
 and they'll actually stay –
 
 00:27:53.307 --> 00:27:55.147
 for a whole other day outside New London,
 
 00:27:55.169 --> 00:27:55.828
 which is just going to
 
 00:27:55.868 --> 00:27:57.729
 cause panic because there's
 
 00:27:57.749 --> 00:27:58.648
 rumors in town that
 
 00:27:58.729 --> 00:27:59.529
 Arnold's actually going to
 
 00:27:59.549 --> 00:28:00.930
 sail up the river and
 
 00:28:00.970 --> 00:28:02.349
 attack Norwich too because
 
 00:28:03.050 --> 00:28:04.371
 somebody heard the day of
 
 00:28:04.391 --> 00:28:05.270
 the attack that Arnold's
 
 00:28:05.290 --> 00:28:06.050
 going to go up the river
 
 00:28:06.090 --> 00:28:07.071
 and burn his uncle's house.
 
 00:28:07.571 --> 00:28:09.771
 So there's a whole panic about that.
 
 00:28:10.112 --> 00:28:11.452
 It's only wind conditions.
 
 00:28:12.292 --> 00:28:13.853
 When the wind conditions somewhat improve,
 
 00:28:13.873 --> 00:28:15.173
 they retreat to Plum Island,
 
 00:28:16.213 --> 00:28:16.933
 which is off the eastern
 
 00:28:16.973 --> 00:28:18.295
 coast of Long Island, again,
 
 00:28:18.355 --> 00:28:19.734
 waiting for better wind conditions.
 
 00:28:20.421 --> 00:28:21.221
 then eventually they'll
 
 00:28:21.320 --> 00:28:22.261
 start to go back to New
 
 00:28:22.281 --> 00:28:23.423
 York a couple days later.
 
 00:28:24.103 --> 00:28:27.505
 And as they glide along Long Island Sound,
 
 00:28:27.825 --> 00:28:29.204
 they are causing huge
 
 00:28:29.224 --> 00:28:30.746
 amounts of panic all across
 
 00:28:30.786 --> 00:28:31.626
 Connecticut because they
 
 00:28:31.666 --> 00:28:32.987
 think there are other attacks coming.
 
 00:28:33.867 --> 00:28:35.147
 So you're talking a very
 
 00:28:35.228 --> 00:28:36.648
 massive mobilization of
 
 00:28:36.689 --> 00:28:37.789
 Connecticut militia going
 
 00:28:37.809 --> 00:28:40.490
 to every coastal town, New Haven,
 
 00:28:41.111 --> 00:28:42.412
 Killingworth, which is now Clinton,
 
 00:28:43.673 --> 00:28:45.554
 Fairfield, Stanford, all sorts, you know.
 
 00:28:47.310 --> 00:28:49.311
 But did they land anywhere
 
 00:28:49.332 --> 00:28:51.032
 else along the Connecticut coast?
 
 00:28:51.073 --> 00:28:54.394
 They briefly attacked some
 
 00:28:54.515 --> 00:28:55.655
 ships outside of what was
 
 00:28:55.695 --> 00:28:57.376
 then Killingworth, which is now Clinton.
 
 00:28:59.637 --> 00:29:00.038
 Originally,
 
 00:29:00.057 --> 00:29:01.318
 it was a British Navy operation.
 
 00:29:01.439 --> 00:29:02.098
 I think they saw like a
 
 00:29:02.138 --> 00:29:03.059
 privateer and they were
 
 00:29:03.079 --> 00:29:03.759
 going to go after it.
 
 00:29:04.580 --> 00:29:05.800
 And then the Associated Loyalists,
 
 00:29:05.820 --> 00:29:07.061
 which had their own vessels with them.
 
 00:29:07.673 --> 00:29:08.595
 They joined in the attack
 
 00:29:08.615 --> 00:29:09.395
 and they actually went up
 
 00:29:09.435 --> 00:29:10.596
 close and got encountered.
 
 00:29:10.636 --> 00:29:13.799
 And they will trade some volleys,
 
 00:29:14.160 --> 00:29:15.280
 some artillery shots with
 
 00:29:15.300 --> 00:29:16.442
 the militia on shore.
 
 00:29:17.123 --> 00:29:17.864
 They'll burn a couple of
 
 00:29:17.884 --> 00:29:19.505
 houses on Duck Island.
 
 00:29:20.346 --> 00:29:20.705
 And again,
 
 00:29:20.746 --> 00:29:22.387
 this is only freaking people out
 
 00:29:22.468 --> 00:29:23.669
 even more because, oh, my gosh,
 
 00:29:23.689 --> 00:29:24.609
 they're attacking this place.
 
 00:29:24.630 --> 00:29:25.911
 They're going to attack New Haven next.
 
 00:29:26.832 --> 00:29:27.932
 But eventually they pull away.
 
 00:29:28.473 --> 00:29:29.795
 I think they took like one whale boat.
 
 00:29:30.154 --> 00:29:30.556
 So it wasn't.
 
 00:29:31.528 --> 00:29:32.087
 Yeah.
 
 00:29:32.107 --> 00:29:33.388
 Is that part of the purpose of it, though,
 
 00:29:33.409 --> 00:29:34.548
 just to terrorize people
 
 00:29:34.568 --> 00:29:35.710
 and make them think they're
 
 00:29:35.730 --> 00:29:37.230
 going to land somewhere?
 
 00:29:37.310 --> 00:29:39.351
 I think originally that was the plan.
 
 00:29:39.412 --> 00:29:40.872
 It was just, you know, again,
 
 00:29:41.231 --> 00:29:42.692
 make Washington think
 
 00:29:42.732 --> 00:29:44.493
 you're going to attack Connecticut.
 
 00:29:44.513 --> 00:29:45.894
 So this would have helped play into it.
 
 00:29:45.933 --> 00:29:46.434
 Definitely.
 
 00:29:47.095 --> 00:29:47.454
 Right.
 
 00:29:47.474 --> 00:29:48.414
 That definitely that part
 
 00:29:48.455 --> 00:29:49.096
 definitely worked.
 
 00:29:49.195 --> 00:29:49.756
 But by then,
 
 00:29:49.816 --> 00:29:50.997
 Washington's already south of
 
 00:29:51.017 --> 00:29:51.576
 Philadelphia.
 
 00:29:51.656 --> 00:29:52.156
 So there's really.
 
 00:29:52.176 --> 00:29:55.939
 Yeah, they didn't know he was already gone,
 
 00:29:55.979 --> 00:29:57.419
 that he was feigning this
 
 00:29:57.459 --> 00:29:58.640
 attack on New York, but.
 
 00:29:58.976 --> 00:29:59.215
 Yeah.
 
 00:29:59.276 --> 00:30:00.237
 So the attack.
 
 00:30:00.457 --> 00:30:00.897
 Oh, my gosh.
 
 00:30:00.917 --> 00:30:02.900
 I think it's set sail at September fourth,
 
 00:30:03.200 --> 00:30:03.800
 which is right.
 
 00:30:04.320 --> 00:30:05.001
 Yeah.
 
 00:30:05.021 --> 00:30:05.501
 And by then,
 
 00:30:05.561 --> 00:30:07.144
 Washington's already across Delaware.
 
 00:30:07.523 --> 00:30:08.684
 That is the day that
 
 00:30:08.826 --> 00:30:09.786
 actually Sir Henry Clinton
 
 00:30:09.826 --> 00:30:10.948
 admits that he finally
 
 00:30:11.028 --> 00:30:13.730
 realizes that he's been fooled.
 
 00:30:13.950 --> 00:30:15.511
 And he's actually considers
 
 00:30:15.571 --> 00:30:17.233
 very briefly to cancel the attack.
 
 00:30:17.798 --> 00:30:18.900
 And he doesn't because he
 
 00:30:18.920 --> 00:30:20.080
 believes they've sent the
 
 00:30:20.101 --> 00:30:21.321
 British Navy out in search
 
 00:30:21.382 --> 00:30:22.702
 of the French Navy.
 
 00:30:23.542 --> 00:30:24.364
 And they have a couple of
 
 00:30:24.384 --> 00:30:25.305
 days wiggle room here.
 
 00:30:25.345 --> 00:30:25.984
 So let's you know,
 
 00:30:26.326 --> 00:30:27.747
 we wanted to attack New London anyway.
 
 00:30:27.787 --> 00:30:28.948
 Why not just go get it now
 
 00:30:28.968 --> 00:30:29.827
 and then they'll be back
 
 00:30:29.847 --> 00:30:30.608
 and then we can use these
 
 00:30:30.628 --> 00:30:31.950
 troops to go south to
 
 00:30:32.170 --> 00:30:33.151
 Virginia if we need to.
 
 00:30:33.691 --> 00:30:34.132
 Unfortunately,
 
 00:30:34.152 --> 00:30:35.192
 they're gone for a whole week.
 
 00:30:37.193 --> 00:30:37.273
 Yeah.
 
 00:30:37.294 --> 00:30:38.775
 Arnold actually has two
 
 00:30:38.835 --> 00:30:39.796
 horse vessels with him.
 
 00:30:40.316 --> 00:30:42.557
 And he also has a bunch of sailors on loan,
 
 00:30:43.218 --> 00:30:44.819
 which the British Navy will
 
 00:30:44.880 --> 00:30:46.121
 need to go south to Yorktown.
 
 00:30:47.409 --> 00:30:49.009
 So how many horses does he have?
 
 00:30:52.692 --> 00:30:52.992
 I don't know.
 
 00:30:53.093 --> 00:30:54.554
 I tried looking for numbers.
 
 00:30:55.575 --> 00:30:57.036
 At least part of one unit.
 
 00:30:57.776 --> 00:30:58.977
 The officers have horses.
 
 00:30:58.997 --> 00:31:00.258
 The artillery have horses.
 
 00:31:01.137 --> 00:31:02.479
 There might be a couple wagons in there.
 
 00:31:02.558 --> 00:31:03.480
 And there's actually the
 
 00:31:03.500 --> 00:31:04.201
 American Legion...
 
 00:31:05.506 --> 00:31:06.807
 They're an infantry cavalry
 
 00:31:06.886 --> 00:31:08.048
 unit and part of their unit
 
 00:31:08.228 --> 00:31:09.388
 is actually mounted during
 
 00:31:09.429 --> 00:31:10.048
 the expedition.
 
 00:31:11.250 --> 00:31:13.011
 So they have some horses as well.
 
 00:31:13.791 --> 00:31:14.853
 So this is actually a pretty
 
 00:31:14.893 --> 00:31:16.173
 substantial fleet that
 
 00:31:16.314 --> 00:31:17.734
 Arnold is leading up Long Island Sound.
 
 00:31:17.755 --> 00:31:19.536
 It's about fifteen hundred men,
 
 00:31:19.836 --> 00:31:20.356
 give or take.
 
 00:31:20.957 --> 00:31:23.659
 About how many vessels?
 
 00:31:23.739 --> 00:31:24.200
 Oh, my gosh.
 
 00:31:26.516 --> 00:31:27.135
 I don't have one.
 
 00:31:27.236 --> 00:31:32.517
 Yeah, there's at least, I think,
 
 00:31:32.576 --> 00:31:33.997
 twelve or fifteen transports.
 
 00:31:34.136 --> 00:31:35.637
 There's five or six escorts.
 
 00:31:36.178 --> 00:31:36.917
 Wow.
 
 00:31:36.938 --> 00:31:38.438
 They intended to go up the river.
 
 00:31:38.478 --> 00:31:39.577
 They wanted to go up the Thames River.
 
 00:31:40.258 --> 00:31:40.699
 Okay,
 
 00:31:40.778 --> 00:31:42.898
 so this wasn't just a lay of a couple
 
 00:31:42.919 --> 00:31:43.459
 of guys,
 
 00:31:43.479 --> 00:31:45.199
 a couple of vessels going in and raiding.
 
 00:31:45.239 --> 00:31:46.059
 This is actually a pretty
 
 00:31:46.079 --> 00:31:47.099
 significant invasion.
 
 00:31:47.160 --> 00:31:48.299
 Well, I mean, don't get me wrong.
 
 00:31:48.319 --> 00:31:48.880
 They're only going to go as
 
 00:31:48.920 --> 00:31:49.539
 far as New London,
 
 00:31:49.559 --> 00:31:50.400
 but they didn't know how
 
 00:31:50.420 --> 00:31:51.380
 many privateers were there,
 
 00:31:51.400 --> 00:31:52.800
 so they wanted to be supplied.
 
 00:31:53.540 --> 00:31:53.941
 Yeah, right.
 
 00:31:55.494 --> 00:31:56.576
 Well, thank you so much, Matt.
 
 00:31:56.675 --> 00:31:57.517
 Are there other things we
 
 00:31:57.537 --> 00:31:58.317
 should talk about, Matt?
 
 00:31:58.336 --> 00:31:59.458
 I mean, it's a great story,
 
 00:31:59.538 --> 00:32:01.059
 and I recommend people read
 
 00:32:01.119 --> 00:32:02.101
 The Trader's Homecoming,
 
 00:32:02.121 --> 00:32:03.862
 Benedict Arnold's read on New London,
 
 00:32:03.942 --> 00:32:05.282
 because it really does tell
 
 00:32:05.323 --> 00:32:07.305
 this story in a way, as he said,
 
 00:32:07.365 --> 00:32:07.885
 all the other,
 
 00:32:08.026 --> 00:32:10.347
 the earlier histories really do,
 
 00:32:11.348 --> 00:32:12.308
 don't really get it right,
 
 00:32:12.328 --> 00:32:14.411
 or they improve it too much.
 
 00:32:15.211 --> 00:32:17.814
 I love that phrase.
 
 00:32:17.834 --> 00:32:18.535
 It's a great quote.
 
 00:32:18.575 --> 00:32:19.234
 I wish I could have found
 
 00:32:19.295 --> 00:32:20.355
 more of the correspondence.
 
 00:32:20.375 --> 00:32:22.018
 Yeah, yeah.
 
 00:32:22.077 --> 00:32:22.157
 So,
 
 00:32:22.858 --> 00:32:23.640
 what was the favorite thing
 
 00:32:23.680 --> 00:32:24.359
 you learned the most
 
 00:32:24.420 --> 00:32:25.181
 interesting thing you
 
 00:32:25.221 --> 00:32:26.422
 learned in the process of
 
 00:32:26.442 --> 00:32:27.623
 doing this battle was a lot
 
 00:32:27.663 --> 00:32:28.423
 bigger than I thought it
 
 00:32:28.442 --> 00:32:30.845
 was and there's plenty of
 
 00:32:30.884 --> 00:32:31.925
 room for interpretation
 
 00:32:31.965 --> 00:32:33.567
 here and I was really I
 
 00:32:33.586 --> 00:32:35.068
 mean I was really proud of um
 
 00:32:35.798 --> 00:32:36.980
 giving some of the guys names.
 
 00:32:37.019 --> 00:32:38.141
 The British casualty list is
 
 00:32:38.201 --> 00:32:39.061
 in there for the first time.
 
 00:32:39.442 --> 00:32:40.644
 We're still hunting for the bodies.
 
 00:32:40.703 --> 00:32:42.526
 We have some ideas where they might be,
 
 00:32:43.007 --> 00:32:43.666
 but there's a lot of
 
 00:32:43.727 --> 00:32:45.048
 stories that never got told.
 
 00:32:45.088 --> 00:32:46.490
 I mean, most people have, you know,
 
 00:32:46.509 --> 00:32:47.310
 there's nothing wrong with
 
 00:32:47.330 --> 00:32:47.932
 about Fort Griswold.
 
 00:32:47.951 --> 00:32:48.813
 We found things like ten or
 
 00:32:48.833 --> 00:32:49.854
 fifteen new defenders
 
 00:32:50.273 --> 00:32:51.955
 who've never gotten their recognition.
 
 00:32:52.676 --> 00:32:54.077
 There was one person captured.
 
 00:32:54.377 --> 00:32:55.440
 We only knew his last name,
 
 00:32:56.480 --> 00:32:58.102
 and now he has a first name.
 
 00:32:58.944 --> 00:32:59.445
 And so some of the
 
 00:32:59.506 --> 00:33:01.948
 participation of like Lyme, Connecticut,
 
 00:33:02.008 --> 00:33:04.130
 Norwich, Preston,
 
 00:33:04.170 --> 00:33:04.911
 surrounding towns that
 
 00:33:04.971 --> 00:33:06.231
 never really got their due.
 
 00:33:06.251 --> 00:33:09.474
 So now they finally have some recognition.
 
 00:33:10.455 --> 00:33:10.836
 And of course,
 
 00:33:10.955 --> 00:33:12.617
 Arnold's a fascinating character.
 
 00:33:12.857 --> 00:33:16.280
 And I think someone possibly due for,
 
 00:33:16.301 --> 00:33:16.801
 I don't know if
 
 00:33:16.862 --> 00:33:18.564
 rehabilitation is the right word,
 
 00:33:18.584 --> 00:33:19.924
 but simply, remember,
 
 00:33:20.005 --> 00:33:21.666
 any thoughts on Arnold now
 
 00:33:21.686 --> 00:33:22.887
 having finished this project?
 
 00:33:25.250 --> 00:33:25.932
 don't know what to say about
 
 00:33:26.011 --> 00:33:27.012
 arnold I mean I didn't I
 
 00:33:27.032 --> 00:33:27.834
 never wanted this to be
 
 00:33:27.874 --> 00:33:28.915
 like an arnold biography
 
 00:33:29.375 --> 00:33:30.017
 yeah yeah I didn't really
 
 00:33:30.037 --> 00:33:30.998
 go too much into detail
 
 00:33:31.038 --> 00:33:32.119
 about things like that but
 
 00:33:33.401 --> 00:33:34.342
 how can you do this this is
 
 00:33:34.382 --> 00:33:35.443
 like I mean he did treat
 
 00:33:35.483 --> 00:33:37.486
 some people nicely we can
 
 00:33:37.506 --> 00:33:39.428
 call it in new london but I
 
 00:33:39.528 --> 00:33:41.912
 I don't unders I don't I have no comment
 
 00:33:42.647 --> 00:33:43.508
 Okay, good.
 
 00:33:43.607 --> 00:33:44.068
 Okay.
 
 00:33:44.108 --> 00:33:44.449
 Thank you.
 
 00:33:45.669 --> 00:33:47.250
 So we've been talking with Matt Reardon,
 
 00:33:47.569 --> 00:33:49.069
 author of The Trader's Homecoming,
 
 00:33:49.130 --> 00:33:50.770
 Benedict Arnold's Raid Under London,
 
 00:33:50.830 --> 00:33:51.330
 Connecticut,
 
 00:33:51.351 --> 00:33:52.751
 September fourth through thirteenth,
 
 00:33:52.771 --> 00:33:53.791
 seventeen eighty one.
 
 00:33:54.692 --> 00:33:56.133
 And I want to thank you for
 
 00:33:56.173 --> 00:33:58.313
 joining us and for telling
 
 00:33:58.333 --> 00:33:59.733
 this story in a new way.
 
 00:33:59.933 --> 00:34:02.494
 And I look forward to hearing more.
 
 00:34:02.674 --> 00:34:04.736
 And congratulations to
 
 00:34:04.816 --> 00:34:05.875
 recently promoted to
 
 00:34:05.915 --> 00:34:07.696
 captain in the Connecticut State Guard.
 
 00:34:07.876 --> 00:34:08.336
 Thank you for.
 
 00:34:08.945 --> 00:34:10.885
 serving there and so I want
 
 00:34:10.905 --> 00:34:12.346
 to thank jonathan lane our
 
 00:34:12.385 --> 00:34:14.425
 producer as well as our
 
 00:34:14.465 --> 00:34:15.525
 listeners around the
 
 00:34:15.565 --> 00:34:16.626
 country and every week I
 
 00:34:16.666 --> 00:34:17.606
 thank someone if you're one
 
 00:34:17.646 --> 00:34:19.847
 of these places um or if
 
 00:34:19.867 --> 00:34:21.067
 you're not send jonathan
 
 00:34:21.146 --> 00:34:22.527
 lane an email jay lane
 
 00:34:22.568 --> 00:34:25.407
 revolution and he will send
 
 00:34:25.447 --> 00:34:27.307
 you some rev two fifty swag
 
 00:34:27.849 --> 00:34:28.909
 always happy to hear from
 
 00:34:28.969 --> 00:34:30.608
 folks and this week I want
 
 00:34:30.628 --> 00:34:31.748
 to thank our listeners in
 
 00:34:32.188 --> 00:34:34.889
 morristown tennessee lima ohio
 
 00:34:36.237 --> 00:34:37.478
 I don't know if they pronounce it Lyman.
 
 00:34:37.538 --> 00:34:38.157
 I apologize.
 
 00:34:38.778 --> 00:34:40.079
 Here in Massachusetts,
 
 00:34:40.119 --> 00:34:41.641
 both Jamaica Plain and Brighton,
 
 00:34:41.960 --> 00:34:45.264
 Munich in Germany, the Bronx, Oklahoma,
 
 00:34:45.384 --> 00:34:47.606
 Amman, Jordan, and Los Angeles,
 
 00:34:47.666 --> 00:34:48.365
 California,
 
 00:34:48.445 --> 00:34:49.907
 all places between and beyond.
 
 00:34:49.947 --> 00:34:50.748
 Thanks for joining us.
 
 00:34:50.807 --> 00:34:52.128
 And now we will be piped out
 
 00:34:52.509 --> 00:34:53.409
 on the road to Boston.